More on life in the National Security State

[Lindsey]

From "Democracy Now!" on Friday:

Two leading U.S. peace activists were denied entry into Canada on Wednesday after their names appeared on an FBI criminal database that the Canadian government is using at its borders. Ann Wright, a retired Army colonel and former diplomat, and Medea Benjamin, co-founder of women’s peace group CODEPINK, were headed to Toronto to discuss peace and security issues at the invitation of the Toronto Stop the War Coalition. Canadian authorities detained and questioned them for several hours at the border crossing between Buffalo and Niagara Falls.

The two women were apparently denied entry into Canada because their names appeared on an FBI-run international criminal database. Ann Wright and Medea Benjamin do have nine convictions between them, but all involving civil disobedience committed while protesting the war in Iraq.

On Thursday, they met with immigration officials at the Canadian embassy in Washington, D.C. and held a news conference outside. Ann Wright joins me now from Washington. She is a retired Army colonel and former diplomat who quit a 16-year State Department career following the invasion of Iraq in March 2003.

http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=07/10/05/1419236

--Lindsey

[Judy G. Russell]

"Two leading U.S. peace activists were denied entry into Canada on Wednesday after their names appeared on an FBI criminal database that the Canadian government is using at its borders"

Oh for pete's sake...

[ndebord]

"Two leading U.S. peace activists were denied entry into Canada on Wednesday after their names appeared on an FBI criminal database that the Canadian government is using at its borders"

Oh for pete's sake...

Judy,

Pete was detained also as they thought he was Pete Seeger.

sigh

[Lindsey]

Oh for pete's sake...
The Canadian immigration authorities told them they would have to fill out an 18-page "criminal rehabilitation packet" before they would ever again be eligible to enter Canada.

And, in fact, Wright was stopped at the border in August on her way to a Security and Prosperity Partnership conference, apparently for the same reason, but in that case they let her buy her way in with a 3-day temporary residency permit for $200.

Gotta love bureaucracy. :rolleyes:

--Lindsey

[Judy G. Russell]

Pete was detained also as they thought he was Pete Seeger. sighNow that's funny.

[Judy G. Russell]

The Canadian immigration authorities told them they would have to fill out an 18-page "criminal rehabilitation packet" before they would ever again be eligible to enter Canada.Geez louise... what a nightmare this whole thing has become.

[Lindsey]

Geez louise... what a nightmare this whole thing has become.
They also have to go five years without another conviction. Wright says that in that case, there is no way they will ever be "criminally rehabilitated". They're not going to stop their peace activism.

--Lindsey

[Judy G. Russell]

They also have to go five years without another conviction. Wright says that in that case, there is no way they will ever be "criminally rehabilitated". They're not going to stop their peace activism.What's amazing is that Canada is allowing itself to be dictated to like this.

[Lindsey]

What's amazing is that Canada is allowing itself to be dictated to like this.
That really is amazing -- but then, isn't their current prime minister a Bush fan?

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

That really is amazing -- but then, isn't their current prime minister a Bush fan?

--Lindsey


Lindsey,

Oh yes. Conservatives in control in a commonwealth is never a good idea. They need a Tony Blair type (not the Bush-puppet version) there real soon now.

[Judy G. Russell]

That really is amazing -- but then, isn't their current prime minister a Bush fan?I didn't know Bush had any fans left...

[ndebord]

That really is amazing -- but then, isn't their current prime minister a Bush fan?

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

He is definitely a Tory for sure.

http://canadaonline.about.com/cs/conservativeparty/p/stephenharper.htm

[Lindsey]

I didn't know Bush had any fans left...
Good point! Laura has been giving him odd looks for a while now, and I'm not too sure abour Barney, either.

I understand that Congressional Republicans who attended a recent meeting at the White House made no secret of their unhappiness with Bush over the SCHIP veto -- but most of them seem prepared to vote to sustain his veto anyway. Lemmings.

--Lindsey

[Judy G. Russell]

I understand that Congressional Republicans who attended a recent meeting at the White House made no secret of their unhappiness with Bush over the SCHIP veto -- but most of them seem prepared to vote to sustain his veto anyway. Lemmings.Good grief. What a bunch of idiotic spineless jerks.

[Lindsey]

Good grief. What a bunch of idiotic spineless jerks.
Makes you wonder why they have such a hard time getting along with Congressional Democrats...

--Lindsey

[Judy G. Russell]

Makes you wonder why they have such a hard time getting along with Congressional Democrats...'Cause when they ooze into spineless blobs, they ooze in different directions?

[ndebord]

Good point! Laura has been giving him odd looks for a while now, and I'm not too sure abour Barney, either.

I understand that Congressional Republicans who attended a recent meeting at the White House made no secret of their unhappiness with Bush over the SCHIP veto -- but most of them seem prepared to vote to sustain his veto anyway. Lemmings.

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

Ah, ain't "lemmings" the Franklin Dictionary definition of a politician?

<g>

[Lindsey]

'Cause when they ooze into spineless blobs, they ooze in different directions?
LOL!! I guess that must be it!

--Lindsey

[Lindsey]

Ah, ain't "lemmings" the Franklin Dictionary definition of a politician?
You may be right about that, but these days, it seems to reply to Republicans in general, or at least to a certain hardcore group of Republicans. On NPR's "Morning Edition" today, they were talking about a recent poll asking about S-CHIP, and the poll shows this curious thing:

While a majority of Republicans in the poll said they support the bill, a majority also said they don't want Congress to override the president's veto. [Robert] Blendon [of the Harvard School of Public Health, who helped design the poll] says that's not as contradictory as it sounds.

"In the poll, 54 percent of them actually support expansion of the plan as was being debated. But when you get to overturning the veto, you really have six out of 10 that want to stay with the president, which shows that they think he knows something here they weren't aware of, or that they want to just support his leadership," he said.

Tell me that is not pre-Enlightenment thinking: the leader is God's annointed representative, so you have to go along with him no matter what. (And don't tell me that is a far-fetched interpretation of what some of these people think -- a US general is on public record as having said that Bush had been appointed by God.)

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

You may be right about that, but these days, it seems to reply to Republicans in general, or at least to a certain hardcore group of Republicans. On NPR's "Morning Edition" today, they were talking about a recent poll asking about S-CHIP, and the poll shows this curious thing:


Tell me that is not pre-Enlightenment thinking: the leader is God's annointed representative, so you have to go along with him no matter what. (And don't tell me that is a far-fetched interpretation of what some of these people think -- a US general is on public record as having said that Bush had been appointed by God.)

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

You've heard of post-Modern... this is post-enlightenment. Reason is now a "cult" idea I'm afraid.

[Lindsey]

Reason is now a "cult" idea I'm afraid.
Al Gore's latest book is called "Assault on Reason," and that seems to sum the current situation up pretty well.

Incidently, that book of Gore's is a 2007 Quill Awards winner (http://www.wnbc.com/thequills/14078987/detail.html). The guy is winning everything in sight -- he definitely should have decided to go for president this year!!

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

Al Gore's latest book is called "Assault on Reason," and that seems to sum the current situation up pretty well.

Incidently, that book of Gore's is a 2007 Quill Awards winner (http://www.wnbc.com/thequills/14078987/detail.html). The guy is winning everything in sight -- he definitely should have decided to go for president this year!!

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

I'm become a recluse recently... new job and no time to read or watch tv/movies. If it were not for the Web, I'd be completely out of touch.

[Lindsey]

I'm become a recluse recently... new job and no time to read or watch tv/movies. If it were not for the Web, I'd be completely out of touch.
I know what you mean, though I usually have time to read even when I don't have time for the Web, because I always keep a book or two beside my bed, and unless I'm completely wiped out, I will always pick it up before I go to sleep. And if I can't sleep, I end up getting a lot of reading done!

Borders Books had a display of the 2007 Quill Awards nominees, and Gore's book was part of the display.

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

I know what you mean, though I usually have time to read even when I don't have time for the Web, because I always keep a book or two beside my bed, and unless I'm completely wiped out, I will always pick it up before I go to sleep. And if I can't sleep, I end up getting a lot of reading done!

Borders Books had a display of the 2007 Quill Awards nominees, and Gore's book was part of the display.

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

Not sleeping... Brrr... I can sleep anywhere, anytime and wake up when I want to. But staying up to read a book? Hard to do with my hours.

I'll find a way. I have a backlog of books I want to read, just need the time.

<sigh>

Gore, the man who shudda been Prez.

[Lindsey]

I can sleep anywhere, anytime and wake up when I want to.
I envy you!

When I absolutely, positively, have to be somewhere at a given time early in the morning, I often find it easier to stay up all night than to try to get up and get out of the house on time. <sigh>

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

I envy you!

When I absolutely, positively, have to be somewhere at a given time early in the morning, I often find it easier to stay up all night than to try to get up and get out of the house on time. <sigh>

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

I did that (once upon a time). But I'm working 7 days a week now, 14 hours a day (counting the commute), so that would definitely be an interesting experiment in sleep deprivation!

<vbg>

[Lindsey]

But I'm working 7 days a week now, 14 hours a day (counting the commute), so that would definitely be an interesting experiment in sleep deprivation!
14 hours a day, 7 days a week? Ouch!

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

14 hours a day, 7 days a week? Ouch!

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

Believe me, I'm actively looking for ways to cut that down to something more manageable.

<weak grin>

[Lindsey]

Believe me, I'm actively looking for ways to cut that down to something more manageable.
I certainly hope so, because I don't think anyone can keep that up for long without doing some damage to his/her health or psyche! You need some down time that involves more than just sleeping.

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

I certainly hope so, because I don't think anyone can keep that up for long without doing some damage to his/her health or psyche! You need some down time that involves more than just sleeping.

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

Wonder if downtime includes the commute through the Holland Tunnel?

<weak grin>

[Lindsey]

Wonder if downtime includes the commute through the Holland Tunnel?
Commuting through the Holland Tunnel is anything but DOWN time!!!!

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

Commuting through the Holland Tunnel is anything but DOWN time!!!!

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

You mean it doesn't count as downtime when absolutely nothing is moving?


;-)

[Lindsey]

You mean it doesn't count as downtime when absolutely nothing is moving?
My experience is that the more slowly the traffic moves, the higher the drivers' blood pressure!

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

My experience is that the more slowly the traffic moves, the higher the drivers' blood pressure!

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

Normally I would agree with you, but I'm afraid to say I'm probably the reason for high blood pressure in the car behind me. If we're not moving, I just close my eyes until I hear a horn!

<wicked grin>

[Lindsey]

Normally I would agree with you, but I'm afraid to say I'm probably the reason for high blood pressure in the car behind me. If we're not moving, I just close my eyes until I hear a horn!
LOL!! Actually, I can sympathize with that!

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

Al Gore's latest book is called "Assault on Reason," and that seems to sum the current situation up pretty well.

Incidently, that book of Gore's is a 2007 Quill Awards winner (http://www.wnbc.com/thequills/14078987/detail.html). The guy is winning everything in sight -- he definitely should have decided to go for president this year!!

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

We definitely need a President who believes in the Constitution. The latest assault comes from the boys with the Dalmations.

http://rawstory.com/rawreplay/?p=127

“Dept of Homeland Security wants Firefighters to look for terrorists while in the line of duty”

[Lindsey]

“Dept of Homeland Security wants Firefighters to look for terrorists while in the line of duty”
My favorite comment from the ones on that site:

Didn’t the USSR have something similar back in ol Uncle Joe’s day?

Everyone kept an eye on each other and America at the time said that this wasn’t cool and a really bad idea.

Mr Stalin said, “It is all alright. This is for the protection of the state and the protection of her people”.

Seems to be a case of things going full circle.

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

My favorite comment from the ones on that site:

"Didn’t the USSR have something similar back in ol Uncle Joe’s day?

Everyone kept an eye on each other and America at the time said that this wasn’t cool and a really bad idea.

Mr Stalin said, “It is all alright. This is for the protection of the state and the protection of her people”.

Seems to be a case of things going full circle."

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

Yup. After WWI, we demobilized and so were unprepared (relatively speaking) for WWII. The power that were decided they would never be put in such a position again. And so we had Ike's warning about the perfect storm, the so-called military industrial complex, dominating America. I guess with this bunch of theocratic neocons, we have reached Uncle Joe's perfect state.

<sigh>

[Lindsey]

I guess with this bunch of theocratic neocons, we have reached Uncle Joe's perfect state.
A standing army is danger enough, though in today's world there's no alternative for it. But they are trying to turn every aspect of civilian life into a national security exercise. Remember Rumsfeld's desire to enlist the Neighborhood Watch and the mail carriers into spies for the DoD?

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

A standing army is danger enough, though in today's world there's no alternative for it. But they are trying to turn every aspect of civilian life into a national security exercise. Remember Rumsfeld's desire to enlist the Neighborhood Watch and the mail carriers into spies for the DoD?

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

Neighborhood Watch? Ah yes and the 57 cent stamp controversy.

[Lindsey]

Ah yes and the 57 cent stamp controversy.
I don't remember that! But that's a pretty good jab...

--Lindsey

[ndebord]

I don't remember that! But that's a pretty good jab...

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

Yes it is!

;-)

[ndebord]

Al Gore's latest book is called "Assault on Reason," and that seems to sum the current situation up pretty well.

Incidently, that book of Gore's is a 2007 Quill Awards winner (http://www.wnbc.com/thequills/14078987/detail.html). The guy is winning everything in sight -- he definitely should have decided to go for president this year!!

--Lindsey

Lindsey,

FWIW, this from Democracy Now.

http://www.democracynow.org/2007/11/28/the_end_of_america_feminist_social

[Lindsey]

Lindsey,

FWIW, this from Democracy Now.

http://www.democracynow.org/2007/11/28/the_end_of_america_feminist_social
Wow, DN! has been hard at work spiffing up its web site since I was last there, I see! And that was not all that long ago -- probably just before Thanksgiving. I'll have to listen to that program when I have some time; that one sounds like a good one.

Meanwhile, did you catch Naomi Klein on "Countdown" last week? She has been on DN!, too, to talk about her latest book, "The Shock Doctrine," which is possibly along some of the same lines. She was also on DN! debating Alan Greenspan after the release of his own book. She was tough on him, too -- I think he expected even his fiercest critics to give deference to his age and his status as dean of the US financial markets, and he seemed highly offended when she did not.

--Lindsey

[davidh]

Wow, DN! has been hard at work spiffing up its web site since I was last there, I see! And that was not all that long ago -- probably just before Thanksgiving. I'll have to listen to that program when I have some time; that one sounds like a good one.

Meanwhile, did you catch Naomi Klein on "Countdown" last week? She has been on DN!, too, to talk about her latest book, "The Shock Doctrine," which is possibly along some of the same lines. She was also on DN! debating Alan Greenspan after the release of his own book. She was tough on him, too -- I think he expected even his fiercest critics to give deference to his age and his status as dean of the US financial markets, and he seemed highly offended when she did not.

--Lindsey

I think it should be remembered that apparently the only two sects of Judaism that survived the destruction of the Temple and of Jerusalem by the Romans were Rabbinic Judaism (i.e. Pharisees) and Christianity. I believe that according to current Orthodox Judaism, this destruction was to be blamed on "baseless hatred". AFAIK, "baseless hatred" is exhibited by many groups/people nowadays, NOT JUST Republicans and Evangelical Christians.

Of course, one can blame the Jewish Zealots/Siccarii [sp?] who were more or less similar to Al Qaida / Salafism / Wahibism in Islam. For example, in their destruction of the food stores and fuel stores in Jerusalem to try to force the other Jews to go into battle against the Romans.

I think it should also be noted that while the Maccabees saved Judaism and hence Christianity and hence Western European Civilization from the paganism of Antiochus Epiphanes to start with and later the later corruption of Rome, the Hasmonean dynasty coming out of the Maccabee's revolt was probably almost totally corrupt. (I throw out this anecdote for anyone who wishes to celebrate Chanukah.)

Thus the key personages in the stories are: 1. Rabbi Yochanan ben Zakkai 2. Jesus 3. Peter 4. Paul.

Old , old , story or stories.

Sorry, I did not provide any web site links, but it is not hard to find them with today's current web browsers.

Of course, one must also give credit to the Roman General Vespasian et al. If one adcepts Professor Wheeler's [sp?] theory of the participatory universe. That is,that phenomena should not be considered in isolation from each other.

DH

[Lindsey]

I'm not a student of ancient history, so while I am familiar with the stories in general, I don't know enough details to comment, and having been badly burned in the past for venturing opinions on the more modern history of Israel, you will have to forgive me if I prefer not to touch this, other than to say that it is the rare historical development that does not have both good and bad consequences.

--Lindsey