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heinz57g
December 15th, 2006, 04:17 AM
anybody else experiencing this? TAPCIS logs on, is then told there are 105 mssgs waiting, then
CIS says THANK YOU and TAPCIS logs off.

no listing or downloading of any of the waiting mssgs, nor any sending of pending ones on queue.

doesnt matter which computer, which dial-up point or node i use, vienna, munich, UK or USA, same
reaction. or better: non-reaction.

anything in the interface between CIS and TAPCIS changed past 2 days?

greetings - heinz -

Dodi Schultz
December 15th, 2006, 12:28 PM
I haven't experienced a problem, Heinz.

But perhaps it's your local connection. I'm in New York.

--DS

Lindsey
December 15th, 2006, 11:00 PM
TAPCIS logs on, is then told there are 105 mssgs waiting, then CIS says THANK YOU and TAPCIS logs off.
Any chance you could capture a log? If you're not now capturing a session log, you can tell TAPCIS to do it by going into the TAPCIS.INI file with a plain text editor and setting up something like this there:

[Logging]
Log=Append

You'll need to add a logging section if you don't already have one. I've forgotton what all of the various possible settings are, but Append will start capturing and keep on until you delete the log or take that setting out of TAPCIS.INI. It will write a session log to a file named ONLINE.LOG in whatever folder you have logging set for; I don't remember what the default folder is. Possibly your main TAPCIS folder.

Anyway, once you have a file, you can either upload it as an attachment here on a reply to this message, or send it via email to krubut39632 (at) mypacks.net. I'm hoping that may give some indication of what is going on.

--Lindsey

heinz57g
December 16th, 2006, 11:11 AM
loging into NYC also didnt help, it was all over.

managed to find somebody at CIS HELP in amsterdam who at least knew that CIS CLASSIC still existed, and she
even called back: problem was known, CIS would not react to the (GO TO) HMI MAIL command, but close the connection.

and well, about 5 hours later (late late friday in EUR) the problem was gone, and everything was back to normal.

still, if anybody hears anything, i wld still like to know what went wrong.

yes lindsey, all my login are fully logged, so i cld provide one of the attempts once i get back to the TAPCIS setup later.

but: you wont see much. right after CIS says ''xx mssgs waiting'' the GOTO HMI MAIL commend is issued and immdtly
answered with the standard GOODBYE by CIS.

greetings - heinz -

PS: note pls that accessing the files and downloading them using the CIS software (v4.0) worked, it seemed (to me
at least) as if only the access with TAPCIS was affected. has any of you actually used TAPCIS thu/fri?

Lindsey
December 17th, 2006, 12:03 AM
yes lindsey, all my login are fully logged, so i cld provide one of the attempts once i get back to the TAPCIS setup later.
Not necessary -- sounds like you got as much of an answer from Customer Service in Amsterdam as I could have given you: that CompuServe was for some reason shutting down the connection on a GOTO MAILHMI command. But as to how that might have happened -- haven't a clue.

it seemed (to me at least) as if only the access with TAPCIS was affected. has any of you actually used TAPCIS thu/fri?
I'm not sure that CompuServe would likely have said they were aware of it if it was only a problem for TAPCIS. If the CSR's description to you was correct, it should have affected anyone using MAILHMI, or at least using it on whatever server was affected. But I'm not sure why you wouldn't have seen it with the CompuServe software.

And I think the problem may have been local to one or a few mail (or login) servers, because Dodi indicated on Friday afternoon that she had not seen a similar problem.

--Lindsey

heinz57g
December 17th, 2006, 04:13 AM
lindsey, you are right, i did NOT mention TAPCIS when i asked in AMS. that usually only
confuses the issue, because hardly anybody (nobody ?) of the people there has ever heard of it.

log-in nodes, see the start of my mssg, i tried as many as i could, some 5-7 of them, all over the
world, same effect. thats also why i asked if those who reported no problem actually used
TAPCIS? dodi? why there was a difference between TAPCIS and other software (CS4) also baffled me.

greetings - heinz -

heinz57g
December 17th, 2006, 05:49 AM
verflixt (german, trying to remain polite) ... its back, and in a new strain: queued outgoing mssg are
being sent, waiting incoming ones are being ignored. not listed/read/noticed at all.

again, reading with CS4.0.2 works fine.

greetings - heinz -

PS: written sunday 12:45h CEWT, noticed about 30 minutes ago, some 10-15 tries various ways.

PPS: update some 45 minutes later - now sending mssgs is also gone.

davidh
December 17th, 2006, 09:25 AM
verflixt (german, trying to remain polite) ... its back, and in a new strain: queued outgoing mssg are
being sent, waiting incoming ones are being ignored. not listed/read/noticed at all.

again, reading with CS4.0.2 works fine.

greetings - heinz -

PS: written sunday 12:45h CEWT, noticed about 30 minutes ago, some 10-15 tries various ways.

PPS: update some 45 minutes later - now sending mssgs is also gone.

Some possible variations to consider for the purpose of diagnosis:

1. CS 4.0.2 using Winsock (TCP/IP -- telnet) versus using regular old style Windows serial I/O.

2. CS 4.0.2 being used to read mail in "batch" mode or in "interactive" mode.

3. Trying different (lower) baud rates in TAPCIS or in regular serial I/O mode in CS 4.0.2.

4. CS 4.0.2 Winsock over broadband TCP/IP versus dial-up TCP/IP (if you use broadband).

I mention these because they all might affect timing more or less. Assuming that CS 4.0.2 and TAPCIS are using the same protocol in the same way, then probably the only possible difference between the two applications that the server side would "see" would be timing.

DH

heinz57g
December 17th, 2006, 10:04 AM
david, the only way i can use CS402 is the standard interactive method
installed under WIN XP, using a braodband (aDSL) connection. i have this
prog only as a backup if everything fails on a single laptop. and for
interactive access where it is needed for sure.

uisng TAPCIS on different nodes and speeds has no effect, have tried
several combinations. as i can also use it on 6 different computers
(down to a real dos-only one), it cannot be the setup on any single one.

as far as i can recall, nothing similar has happened for 10+ years,
but that might not mean much.

greetings - heinz -

davidh
December 17th, 2006, 10:44 AM
david, the only way i can use CS402 is the standard interactive method
installed under WIN XP, using a braodband (aDSL) connection. i have this
prog only as a backup if everything fails on a single laptop. and for
interactive access where it is needed for sure.


In the past, I used mostly WINCIM 2.x and CS 3.x, but CS 4.x very little. However I think they all have a check box that you can check to tell the CS program that you want to get and send all mail in a batch and log off and then read the msgs OFFLINE. That is, opposed to the the interactive method where you look at the list of messages on the server and just click on the ones you want to read, you download incoming and upload outgoing in one batch.

So if you haven't tried the get and send in a batch (which is what TAPCIS usually does) with CS 4 yet, you might want to try and see if you can find that check box, to try it out.

I think the default setting for CS 1 thru 4 programs was the interactive setting (non-batch), because that maximized online time and revenue to CS.

DH

Judy G. Russell
December 17th, 2006, 12:50 PM
david, the only way i can use CS402 is the standard interactive method installed under WIN XP, using a braodband (aDSL) connection. i have this prog only as a backup if everything fails on a single laptop. and for interactive access where it is needed for sure.Heinz, have you ever set up CServe for POP3 mail? That's often the best of all possible worlds. You can then collect your mail in any standard POP3 mail client (provided Compuserve isn't self-destructing). I might also add that moving away from Compuserve as your primary email address is probably a good idea as well.

heinz57g
December 17th, 2006, 02:20 PM
david, i will certainly look for this button, and try that batch method you mention. it would
certainly circle in the problem somehow.

judy, dont worry, i can read my emails, and i can also answer them, AND write new ones, out of
my CIS account. getting rather scared when things broke down once two years ago, i have set up a
multitude of parallel backup systems, some 6-8 of them: YAHOO and GMX picks up every 15 minutes,
MAIL2WEB on command, ePROMPTER (perfect! can be set any way you want it) is the main access
anyhow, and so on and on. and all of this on my single CIS CLASSIC account using POP3, but not
erasing them from the CIS server.

then: TAPCIS does the daily (actually 4x day) cleanup, sorts mails and makes them available for
eternity.

and also is the much more comfortable 'client' once you actually have the time to sit down and go
thru old mails at your own pace and leisure.

having them in 6-months-a-time TAP.log file makes searching for old ones much simpler, and even
faster then anything else i have tried. accessing them with old but simple dos progs has not only become
a habit: i cannot count anymore the WIN substitutes i have tried. TAPCIS plus some macros and
other tricks is still unbeatable (or so i believe).

it sure helps that 99% of my mails are strict ASCII files, and maybe it only makes sense in my special
circumstances, but thats how they are.

hope this explains things a bit. and since this NON-HMI mail seems to be an on-OFF-on-OFF problem
(it was OK an hour ago, but OFF most of today), i have the feeling (optimist!) somebody is working on it.

greetings - heinz -

PS:
>> ... provided Compuserve isn't self-destructing ...
please, judy, please: peace at least for the xmas season!

Lindsey
December 17th, 2006, 11:01 PM
log-in nodes, see the start of my mssg, i tried as many as i could, some 5-7 of them, all over the world
No, I was talking about the login server. I've been away from the specifics for too long to be sure, but I think the server that handles your login is not a function of the node you call. I thought it was a function of your account, but that still doesn't explain why you don't see the same problems with the CompuServe software, unless there is something different about the way they handle that navigation.

--Lindsey

Judy G. Russell
December 17th, 2006, 11:24 PM
PS: >> ... provided Compuserve isn't self-destructing ...please, judy, please: peace at least for the xmas season!I'll drink to that... some rum-laced eggnog, of course!

Dodi Schultz
December 17th, 2006, 11:47 PM
Dodi here again. Am I the only one left in the US using TAPCIS???

In reply to Heinz and anyone else who's wondering: I haven't had any problem--not Thursday or Friday, not Saturday, not Sunday. I use TAPCIS for e-mail all the time (I occasionally pick up stuff from Mail2Web, as well, if I happen to be passing by there).

Seems to me, Heinz, from your description and CompuServe's reaction, that there may have been something amiss in--or in a connection with--Europe. Possible?

--Dodi

davidh
December 18th, 2006, 12:51 AM
I'll drink to that... some rum-laced eggnog, of course!

I'll take brandy instead. And easy on the sugar and heavier on the eggs and cream, please.

DH

davidh
December 18th, 2006, 01:07 AM
Dodi here again. Am I the only one left in the US using TAPCIS???

I still miss TAPCIS, but the free google mail and AIM (aol) mail are very flexible and powerful.

google allows *simultaneous*:

1. POP-ing your mail into your computer for offline reading
2. online web based reading of mail with a browser
3. forwarding to any another email account

plus 2.7 giga bytes online storage

AIM *and* AOL (now also free) mail is IMAP protocol instead of POP3 (so you need a email program such as Netscape or Thunderbird for IMAP), but with IMAP:

1. you can read your AIM mail as web mail with your favorite browser

2. read it offline with Thunderbird (etc.) *and* offline and online will *automatically* be synchronized (i.e. same folder names, etc.)

plus 2.0 gigi boots online storage ;)

I maybe someday I'll install Linux and do this all with Thunderbird on Linux. I'm getting tired of critical updates in so many programs in Windows. At least for now Linux seems to be a little lower on the radar screen of the bad guys.

DH

heinz57g
December 18th, 2006, 06:41 AM
>> dodi: ... Am I the only one left in the US using TAPCIS???

dodi, dont worry, class prevails. they just dont know what they are missing.

and now, just so we can see what i am talking about, here some logs:

****** here a proper login as it was yesterday for about 4 hours *******

[TAPCIS(17:07:42): Connected to CompuServe Information Service]

Connected to CIS/CompuServe Information Service via TP3&O6
Last access on 17-Dec-06 at 13:07:15

You have 10 Mail messages waiting

> GO MAILHMI
[TAPCIS(17:07:42): Navigating to MAILHMI]
[TAPCIS(17:07:42): Requesting page CIS:MAILHMI]
[TAPCIS(17:07:43): BP_MSG_SET_BPLUS_PARMS 0x411]
[TAPCIS(17:07:43): HMI_MSG_HANDLE_SUSPEND 0x509]

One moment please...
[TAPCIS(17:07:44): BP_MSG_SET_BPLUS_PARMS 0x411]
[TAPCIS(17:07:45): HMI_MSG_HANDLE_SUSPEND 0x509]

One moment please...
[TAPCIS(17:07:45): Host requests change of protocols]

CompuServe Mail
[TAPCIS(17:07:45): Requesting Mail configuration]

12 messages pending

wtCurrentTime.tzZone.cMinutes 0
.cHours 0
.cDirection 0
.tsTime 17-Dec-06 17:07:14
wReadMsgs 0
wUnreadMsgs 12
wPriorityMsgs 0
wReturnedMsgs 0
wUndeliveredMsgs 0
wOptions 0x0000
wRestrictions 0x0008
wMaxRecipients 50
wcCurrency 0

> Handling Marked Mail messages
[TAPCIS(17:07:46): Handling Marked Mail messages]
[TAPCIS(17:07:46): msgIdent: MC3-1-D530-65BF/1]

***** then it scans all the pending mssgs, and logs off *****



***** and here one from this morning ******

Connected to CIS/CompuServe Information Service via TP3&O6
Last access on 17-Dec-06 at 22:52:08

You have 25 Mail messages waiting

[Session: N/New Inbox (T6COM 6.2c)]
; H:\TAP\ACTIONS\ONLINE.BOX created 18-Dec-06 08:36:25
!, MAIL, SCANMAIL

[TAPCIS(08:37:11): Logging off]
[TAPCIS(08:37:11): Terminating Protocol]
[TAPCIS(08:37:11): Terminating Transport]

Thank you for using CompuServe!

Off at 08:36 CET 18-Dec-06

************************************************** ***********


to me, totally different logs. the 'good' one is asking GO MAILHMI
right at the beginning, after saying how many mssgs are waiting.

that GO MAILHMI is totally missing on the bad login.

and from just now, two logins only 2 minutes apart:

***********************

Connected to CIS/CompuServe Information Service via T05&O6
Last access on 18-Dec-06 at 13:06:30 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

You have 34 Mail messages waiting

> GO MAILHMI
[TAPCIS(13:12:03): Navigating to MAILHMI] <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
etc etc etc

One moment please...

One moment please...
[TAPCIS(13:12:06): Host requests change of protocols]

CompuServe Mail
[TAPCIS(13:12:06): Requesting Mail configuration]

39 messages pending

wtCurrentTime.tzZone.cMinutes 0
.cHours 0
.cDirection 0
.tsTime 18-Dec-06 13:11:24
wReadMsgs 0
wUnreadMsgs 39
wPriorityMsgs 0
wReturnedMsgs 0
wUndeliveredMsgs 0
wOptions 0x0000
wRestrictions 0x0008
wMaxRecipients 50
wcCurrency 0

> Handling Marked Mail messages

... and then it starts downloading/scanning/sending as normal

*******************************

and here, 30 seconds later:

*******************************

Connected to CIS/CompuServe Information Service via T01&O6
Last access on 18-Dec-06 at 13:06:30 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

You have 28 Mail messages waiting

[Session: N/New Inbox (T6COM 6.2c)]
; H:\TAP\ACTIONS\ONLINE.BOX created 18-Dec-06 13:14:15 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
!, MAIL, MAILMARK, 30, 1
!, MAIL, SCANMAIL

[TAPCIS(13:14:52): Logging off]
[TAPCIS(13:14:52): Terminating Protocol]
[TAPCIS(13:14:52): Terminating Transport]

Thank you for using CompuServe!

Off at 13:14 CET 18-Dec-06
Connect time = 0:01

*********************************

originally, i thought i had a corrupted TAPCIS file or some problems
with the log files, but then it turned out that i got the same effect
onb three (later 5) different computers, and it would make no sense
that they all develop the same fault the very same day, no? they are
even sitting in different countries.

BUT: here i just noticed something, now marked with <<<<<<< above:

the first login just now, at about 13:12h, made CIS say that the
Last Access was at 13:06:30h, which was correct.

the second login, at about 13:14h, made again CIS say the last access
was at 13:06:30h, the very same. it totally ignore the login and
download two minutes earlier!

so could there be some sync problem between CIS servers? mail is accessed,
even downloaded, on one, and the other ones are not synced properly?

this is a bit over my head, but why would a login ignore the previous
one totally? on the quick, i checked some login files form last month,
and even if login followed each other within as little as 15 seconds, the previous
was alway mentioned correctly.

is this the hint we have been looking for? and if yes, what do we do
with it?

greetings - heinz -

davidh
December 18th, 2006, 11:01 AM
david, i will certainly look for this button, and try that batch method you mention. it would
certainly circle in the problem somehow.

... provided Compuserve isn't self-destructing ...


Heinz, since you seem to be reading mail (for test purposes) in CS4 in interactive mode, i.e. list message headers first and then select individual messages to open, you might want to try a similar approach with TAPCIS, if the situation does not improve soon.

That is, have TAPCIS merely scan all the message headers and then select part of the messages (or all of the messages) for download. Obviously this is time consuming and inconvenient, and therefore not a good permanent solution, but something to consider.

The problem might also be an omen that it is time to look at other measures, such as ForKeeps and ForMorph applications, that might allow you to import, export, merge, etc. your email message files back and forth between various other email program message-bases.

Another option to consider is whether currently available free desktop search programs (e.g. Google Desktop) can adequately (to your satisfaction) index and retrieve messages from any of the email programs that you currently use or are likely to use in future. Of course, TAPCIS is almost certainly not compatible with any such free desktop search program.

DH

Gary Maltzen
December 18th, 2006, 11:11 AM
so could there be some sync problem between CIS servers? mail is accessed, even downloaded, on one, and the other ones are not synced properly?
Unlikely as Classic mail is stored on SQL servers and accessed via database calls.

Note that when you *drop* an Internet connection it may take the server a few minutes to recognize the connection has failed. It can take up to 20 minutes for an Internet connection to disappear but the POP3 server will generally drop the connection if it doesn't hear from you for 120 seconds.

heinz57g
December 18th, 2006, 02:09 PM
david, first scanning and then selecting i ALWAYS do, anyhow.
the effect mentioned, as you can see from the log, starts long
before CIS is being told to either scan or read, right after login
(and what i think is the switch to HMI).

gary, the seconds you mention might be on the far side, in the
past these periods were just 5-15 seconds max, and then all
was synced. as david mentioned, first scanning, then quickly
selecting, then on a second login with erase/download/ignore
within 15-60 seconds, and it a l w a y s worked fine.

on the samples above, why would the third login ignore the
second? it was just an idea of mine, having something to do
with the fact that no reading / selecting / sending sending was
possible, but it might not have anything to do with it at all.

as it looks, CIS tells me there are XX mssgs waiting, and then,
either before or while it is asked to switch to HMI, it signs off.
well before you can tell it to scan, read or do anything else.

the connection is also not just 'dropped', but shuts down normally
with all command and replies, incl the polite THANK YOU. far from
a 'failed' connection i remember so well from the 1200bd-days.

put it on human terms: the servers says for whatever reason i
am not ready to take up any command, so i rather shut down.

and does just that.

greetings - heinz -

heinz57g
December 18th, 2006, 04:32 PM
here two new ones:

first one 8 hrs after the last login, so one can assume sync is no issue:

****************************************

Connected to CIS/CompuServe Information Service via T02&O6
Last access on 18-Dec-06 at 14:35:31

You have 40 Mail messages waiting

Thank you for using CompuServe!

Off at 22:48 CET 18-Dec-06
Connect time = 0:01
[TAPCIS(22:48:38): Logged Out]

****************************************

at totally new one, where at least an attempt to go to HMI shows, comes
3 minutes later (and again not mentioning the login 3 minutes earlier):

****************************************

Connected to CIS/CompuServe Information Service via T03&O6
Last access on 18-Dec-06 at 14:35:31

You have 40 Mail messages waiting

> GO MAILHMI

One moment please...

One moment please...

CompuServe Mail

45 messages pending

> Leaving mail...

One moment please...

Thank you for using CompuServe!

Off at 22:51 CET 18-Dec-06
Connect time = 0:01
[TAPCIS(22:51:33): Logged Out]

****************************************

this last one, with some added trys, must be the polite xmas version, no?

one thing comes to mind: a long long time ago, late '90s or so, there was a time
when all of a sudden the normal TAPCIS login script did not work, all of a sudden.
there was an uproar (well, there were USERS then), i recall jeff getting into it,
going with somebody else thru the login script, finding out that CIS had changed
not the sequence or wording, but the response timing somehow, putting in some pauses
somewhere, and all was well.

this is just out of memory, so forgive me if not really accurate, but the basic idea
is there: could it be that CIS just now again, knowingly or not, changed the login
timing somewhere, and TAPCIS is either to fast or to slow with reactions, and thats
why it doesn want to go into HMI?

i know i am fishing, but ... anybody any better idea?

greetings - heinz -

Judy G. Russell
December 18th, 2006, 04:48 PM
I'll take brandy instead. And easy on the sugar and heavier on the eggs and cream, please.Hmmm... how 'bout brandy and rum?

davidh
December 18th, 2006, 06:59 PM
Ok

Lindsey
December 18th, 2006, 09:54 PM
Heinz, one of the things that strikes me about the two truncated sessions that you posted is that what appears in the log is out of order with what should be.
The session agenda is showing up after the login has completed, and it should be near the top of the log. Here's the sequence from an old log of mine. Pay attention to the position of the passages marked in red:

[C:\TAPCIS\LOG\ONLINE.LOG opened by T6COM 6.2c]
[TAPCIS(23:22:42): Connect|Out box]
[TAPCIS(23:22:42): Preparing Agenda...]
[TAPCIS(23:22:42): Examining Outbox]
[TAPCIS(23:22:42): Establishing processing order]

[Session: O/Outbox (T6COM 6.2c)]
; C:\TAPCIS\NEW\ONLINE.BOX created 30-May-03 23:22:42
!, MAIL, MAILMARK, 13, 4
!, TAPCIS, LIBSCAN, "12", "", "", "*.*[74774,52]", Y, N, N, N

<snip>

CONNECT 57600
[TAPCIS(23:23:14): CompuServe node login]
[TAPCIS(23:23:14): CR Sent]


0270ZOB

Host Name: CPS

User ID: @?
Present system is PHE on T14!3A at 23:23 Eastern Daylight Time 30-May-03

User ID:[TAPCIS(23:23:15): Logging on to CompuServe]
+74774,52*OTHER/INT\
<snip>
> Handshaking with CompuServe
[TAPCIS(23:23:16): Initializing protocol]
[TAPCIS(23:23:16): DD_MSG_INIT_TRANSLATION 0x210]
[TAPCIS(23:23:16): Initializing code page 437]
[TAPCIS(23:23:16): BP_MSG_SET_BPLUS_PARMS 0x411]
[TAPCIS(23:23:16): Getting Connection information]
[TAPCIS(23:23:16): Connected to CompuServe Information Service]

Connected to CIS/CompuServe Information Service via T14!3A
Last access on 30-May-03 at 20:16:10

You have 14 Mail messages waiting

> GO MAILHMI
[TAPCIS(23:23:16): Navigating to MAILHMI]
[TAPCIS(23:23:16): Requesting page CIS:MAILHMI]
[TAPCIS(23:23:17): BP_MSG_SET_BPLUS_PARMS 0x411]
[TAPCIS(23:23:17): HMI_MSG_HANDLE_SUSPEND 0x509]

One moment please...
[TAPCIS(23:23:18): BP_MSG_SET_BPLUS_PARMS 0x411]
[TAPCIS(23:23:18): HMI_MSG_HANDLE_SUSPEND 0x509]

One moment please...
[TAPCIS(23:23:18): Host requests change of protocols]

CompuServe Mail
[TAPCIS(23:23:18): Requesting Mail configuration]

22 messages pending

wtCurrentTime.tzZone.cMinutes 0
.cHours 0
.cDirection 0
.tsTime 30-May-03 23:23:09
wReadMsgs 0
wUnreadMsgs 22
wPriorityMsgs 0
wReturnedMsgs 0
wUndeliveredMsgs 0
wOptions 0x0000
wRestrictions 0x0008
wMaxRecipients 50
wcCurrency 0

> Handling Marked Mail messages

------------------------

I don't know whether there's any great significance to it. I suspect that misplaced session agenda is the result of a buffer flush or something after the connection is dropped. There's definitely something going wrong, but I can't really tell from what I see whether it's on CompuServe's end, or something with your modem. Do you use that modem for any other kind of connection, or do you only use it with TAPCIS? If you normally only use it for TAPCIS, what happens if you try to use the CompuServe software with a dial-up connection to retrieve your mail?

--Lindsey

Lindsey
December 18th, 2006, 10:06 PM
could it be that CIS just now again, knowingly or not, changed the login timing somewhere, and TAPCIS is either to fast or to slow with reactions, and thats why it doesn want to go into HMI?

If that were the case, you wouldn't be able to log in at all. As it is, it works sometimes, so that would seem to me to preclude a systemic problem of that sort.

I vaguely recall the problem you are talking about, but I think it had something to do with the way the modems on some of the European nodes were configured, not anything to do with the timing. Maybe Jeff remembers the specifics.

--Lindsey

heinz57g
December 19th, 2006, 01:12 AM
lindsey, i was not only using different modems, but different computers in different countries
(at least when i forced the trials past few days), see above.

first thing i always do when such things happen is check hardware, and even on the laptop i
am typing on now, i have switched the modems twice just to make sure.

greetings - heinz -

heinz57g
December 19th, 2006, 03:47 AM
... and it is getting worse: it seems, and i am slowly getting the more or less
angry replies form friends and customers, that many of those mssg that DID
get sent last few days never made it to the recipient. no error came back,
but also nothing arrived.

these are mssgs that are properly acknowledged as being sent by TAPCIS.
am not sure if the mssg ''MESSAGE SENT TO xx ADRESSES'' at the end is a
pure TAPCIS mssg based on CISs interaction, or an actual CIS mssg, but it
sure is there.

slowly i am starting to get worried. some of the missing one i was able to
trace are 2 days ago, not the 'usual' server delay.

greetings - heinz -

davidh
December 19th, 2006, 10:52 AM
david, first scanning and then selecting i ALWAYS do, anyhow.
the effect mentioned, as you can see from the log, starts long
before CIS is being told to either scan or read, right after login
(and what i think is the switch to HMI).


You are correct. I neglected to consider the information contained in the logs you posted.

On another "tack", perhaps forcing TAPCIS to perform a different command BEFORE the "GO MAILHMI" command might help diagnose the problem and/or find a workaround. Specifically, I was thinking that one might ask TAPCIS to run a script BEFORE doing anything involving mail. For example, I believe that there are scripts to "GO BILLING" and retrieve information about such things as time spent online. Incidentally one advantage of GO BILLING is that there probably are no "minutes charged" for GO BILLING.

Another command to experiment with besides GO BILLING might be GO CATHOLIC. I believe that this may be an inactive but still functioning public forum under HMI protocol. The reason that I say this is that http://go.compuserve.com/catholiconline URL still works and takes one to the old web view of that forum. I just mention this because you might not have convenient access to the various GO BILLING scripts that used to be in the FILES part of the TAPCIS forum on compuserve.

In case someone is interested in downloading some of the old scripts (e.g. BILLING scripts), some were zipped into archive(s) and uploaded to the TFFKAT (The Forum Formerly Known As Tapcis) mailing list (group) on Yahoo at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tffkat . However I don't know if moderator Pete Hall is still monitoring that mailing list in order to enable access to it for new members. I believe that mailing list has been inactive for a long time.

DH

Gary Maltzen
December 19th, 2006, 12:24 PM
Heinz,

It occurs to me to ask if the credit card to which your account is billed was recently renewed?

heinz57g
December 19th, 2006, 02:15 PM
gary, that was a good one! you think with a non-valid credit card access only with TAPCIS wld be blocked,
but CIS402 and POP3 and whatever else there is would work? like an anti-TAPCIS conspiracy?

there would anyhow come a warning, the next one is due in march '08.

but: all i would need right now is all of you (even those on cognac and eggnog) to cross your fingers!
for the past (4+?) hours it has worked fine, 5 diff computers in three countries, 7 different dial-up points
tried, not a single failure. i am on my way to set up a candle in the nearest church already.

update in a few hours, ok?

greetings - heinz -

davidh
December 19th, 2006, 03:07 PM
i am on my way to set up a candle in the nearest church already.


I believe that St. Isidore of Seville has been "nominated" as patron saint of the Internet, however, Archangel St. Gabriel would probably also be a good candidate, esp. at Christmas :)

St. Isidore:
"Prolific writer including a dictionary, an encyclopedia, a history of Goths, and a history of the world beginning with creation."
http://www.catholic-forum.com/saints/sainti04.htm

St. Gabriel (Luther Bibel):
http://bibleresources.bible.com/passagesearchresults.php?passage1=Lukas+1:19&version=10

DH

heinz57g
December 19th, 2006, 03:52 PM
ok ok, david, TWO candles then.

will be offline for about 36 hrs, then a recap.

greetings - heinz -

Gary Maltzen
December 19th, 2006, 04:53 PM
Heinz,

I checked with the postmaster and he said that the 'heinz57" account was (indeed) NOT billing-flagged and had e-mail messages which had not yet been opened.

davidh
December 19th, 2006, 05:36 PM
ok ok, david, TWO candles then.


Or "burn the candle at both ends". And, in keeping with the theme of "both", mix both rum *and* brandy with the eggnog.

Actually, for health, I think I'll skip the eggnog and go with buttermilk. I really would rather have buttermilk without the salt but I've never seen American buttermilk in the grocery without it :(

"There are a great many other fermented dairy products, including kefir, koumiss, beverages based on bulgaricus or bifidus strains, labneh, and a host of others. Many of these have developed in regional areas and, depending on the starter organisms used, have various flavours, textures, and components from the fermentation process, such as gas or ethanol."

http://www.foodsci.uoguelph.ca/dairyedu/yogurt.html

DH

heinz57g
December 19th, 2006, 05:56 PM
gary, tks. mssgs, yes, 6 of them this moment, and they will together with new
ones remain till late tmrrw. about 100+ were pulled down last hour.

pity, i liked the conspiracy idea ...

david, no mixing of rum and brandy for me: driving 2500km this night thru the
depth of the balkan.

buttermilk, my favorite. best in austria and germany.

and: how far can a technical discussion go off-topic? buttermilk?

greetings - heinz -

davidh
December 19th, 2006, 06:09 PM
david, no mixing of rum and brandy for me: driving 2500km this night thru the
depth of the balkan.

I'll drink a buttermilk toast to good weather, dry roads, good automotive technology, etc. for your drive.

DH

Lindsey
December 19th, 2006, 08:58 PM
but: all i would need right now is all of you (even those on cognac and eggnog) to cross your fingers! for the past (4+?) hours it has worked fine, 5 diff computers in three countries, 7 different dial-up points tried, not a single failure.
I will not even breathe!

--Lindsey

heinz57g
December 21st, 2006, 04:51 PM
>> good weather, dry roads, good automotive technology

well david, it was snowing heavily between the MK/SR border and north of belgrade, the road
is not even a highway for large parts of it, and the car is a vintage (1992) RENAULT with close to
300.000km on the clock. it has never let me down.

NOW you know why i like TAPCIS?

greetings - heinz -

PS: the trip was great, 17 hrs for the first 1650km, as good as non-stop, now a one day stop, then
another 800+km.

davidh
December 21st, 2006, 05:30 PM
car is a vintage (1992) RENAULT with close to
300.000km on the clock. it has never let me down.
NOW you know why i like TAPCIS?
Sounds like you latched onto some good technology. Perhaps you can give some good recommendations to Santa Claus when he has to overhaul or trade in his sleigh. But with global warming, maybe he'll need camels instead of reindeer. At least it may cut down on the fog, so that Rudolph can take more vacation time.

DH

Lindsey
December 21st, 2006, 10:59 PM
=But with global warming, maybe he'll need camels instead of reindeer.
LOL!!

--Lindsey

heinz57g
January 3rd, 2007, 06:06 AM
well, my ''being off for 36 hrs'' didnt quite work. i guess i keep forgetting how time consuming and
demanding 'family' can be, specially those you havent seen for 20+ years. i am still counting the cousins ...

a very happy new year to all of you here, may it bring all the best, luck, happiness and good health
in quantities and qualities never seen before!

back to my TAPCIS no-sending/no-receiving problem: since i know no better, i want to think our
finger-crossing helped: all mails past two weeks +/- went fine, as it was supposed to be. no more
telling me there were 45 mails and then ignoring them, and so on.

all but one thing: most of you using TAPCIS know that many mssgs, encoded in different ways, arrive in
two parts, the first one having normal text, the second being dowloaded into a MAILxxx.BIN file.
sometimes also the first part is totally empty, and only the BIN file carries the mssg. a pain, but ...

this was explained once in detail quite a while ago, above is the simplified version.

but now, since those two weeks when things are back to normal, that second part only shows
as * BINARY *, and cannot be downloaded, any way i try, into that MAILxxx.BIN file anymore.
whatever i do, part one stays empty, part two stays * BINARY *, and any attempt to READ
or DOWNLOAD it fails.

this came right when reading/senind went back to normal, so i do assume it might have something
to do with any changes they did at CIS with the classic servers.

any idea?

greetings - heinz -

PS: i know one of you will ask for a more specific sample or the headers, so here is one. there is NO way
to get the second, binary part at all tru TAPCIS. reading it with other methods is fine (POP3, MAIL2WEB)
- very strange

************* first part of the mssg: *************


dd: 03-Jan-07 09:07:11
Sb: Ihre Bestellung vom 2.1.2007 *283897*
Fm: INTERNET:versandinfo@reichelt.de
To: heinz gabauer [100022,102]

Contents:

1 Internet Message Header
2 <no topic> * Binary *

========================== Begin Part 1 ===========================
Topic: Internet Message Header

Sender: versandinfo@reichelt.de
Received: from email03.reichelt.de (smtp.reichelt.de [212.184.1.76])
by liaag2ae.mx.compuserve.com (8.13.6/8.13.4/g1.2) with ESMTP id
l0385q2I021903
for <100022.102@compuserve.com>; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 03:07:19 -0500
Received: from file004.reichelt.de (File004 [192.168.0.230] (may be forged))
by email03.reichelt.de (8.13.4/8.13.4/SuSE Linux 0.7) with ESMTP id
l0385fWq011923
for <100022.102@compuserve.com>; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:05:42 +0100
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1])
by file004.reichelt.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBD06A0CCC
for <100022.102@compuserve.com>; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:05:41 +0100 (CET)
Received: from file004.reichelt.de ([127.0.0.1])
by localhost (file004 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP
id 08888-08 for <100022.102@compuserve.com>;
Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:05:39 +0100 (CET)
Received: from file004 (localhost [127.0.0.1])
by file004.reichelt.de (Postfix) with SMTP id DF231A0BBD
for <100022.102@compuserve.com>; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:05:39 +0100 (CET)
Subject: Ihre Bestellung vom 2.1.2007 *283897*
Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:05:39 +0100
Mime-Version: 1.0
Reply-To: versandinfo@reichelt.de
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15"
To: 100022.102@compuserve.com
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
From: versandinfo@reichelt.de
Message-Id: <20070103080539.DF231A0BBD@file004.reichelt.de>
X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on
liaag2ae.mx.compuserve.com
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at reichelt.de
X-Virus-Status: Clean

=================== End Part 1 / Begin Part 2 =====================

% Part 2 is binary

========================== End Part 2 =============================



******* and next part (NOT attached to above, an entirely separate mssg: **********



dd: 03-Jan-07 09:07:11
Sb: Part 2 of Ihre Bestellung vom 2.1.2007 *283897*
Fm: INTERNET:versandinfo@reichelt.de
To: heinz gabauer [100022,102]

* Binary *

davidh
January 3rd, 2007, 10:22 AM
There appears to be no evidence as far as I can see either to support or discount the following theory, but here goes anyway:

There used to be a server side option to choose whether you want the mail headers at the beginning or at the end of the message. I forget how this was done. If it is still possible, it probably would require using the Classic Compuserve (Windows) software to do it.

Just a wild guess, FWIW.

DH

heinz57g
January 3rd, 2007, 03:05 PM
and you think that would change things? i think i know where this is, so i might try it. but
the part above i call the second mssg is a separate mssg by itself, with no header at all.

greetings - heinz -

davidh
January 3rd, 2007, 04:19 PM
and you think that would change things?

Probably not. I'm just grasping at straws.

IIRC, in the past, the parsing done by the CIS servers to break MIME email into parts was not extremely reliable and it would now and then break a message into parts incorrectly, causing some kind of problem or other.

In addition, not all email programs output 100% RFC compliant messages when sending *and* who knows whether or not there might be something in the HTML part(s) that confuses the CIS servers so that it can't find the boundaries between the message parts?

As the years go by, there seems to be an increasing tendency for senders of email to leave the plain text part of messages empty. Perhaps some not only leave it empty but also eliminate it completely? I wonder if that would confuse the CIS servers?

DH

davidh
January 3rd, 2007, 04:24 PM
Some virus checkers running on the local PC and/or the ISP servers may also add stuff to message stating that the message has been checked for viruses. So that would be another possible place for unusual or non-compliant HTML / MIME to come into the picture.

DH

Lindsey
January 3rd, 2007, 11:54 PM
that second part only shows
as * BINARY *, and cannot be downloaded, any way i try, into that MAILxxx.BIN file anymore.
Check your download directory. I'll bet you've got 999 MAILxxx.BIN files in there, and once you get to MAIL999.BIN, TAPCIS has no more names to use. Delete (or move or rename) the files that are in that directory, and you should be able to continue downloading your mail.

--Lindsey

heinz57g
January 4th, 2007, 03:47 AM
games? BETTING? what is going on in this forum? the worst part about your bet, lindsey, is probably
that you even won it.

why cant one look for the obvious first? i used to clean out the mssg files into mssgxxx.old files every
3 months, together with all downloaded files, incl the MAILxxx.BIN files - all of it into separate folders.

with my TAPCIS mail traffic 2006 declining, i decided to do this only every six months now. yes, actual
mssgs had declined, but with so many weirdly formated and coded mssgs (see above) the ratio of those
BIN files actually increased - BINGO.

have not tried it yet, but will in the next few minutes. am nevertheless sure thats what it is.

and what, lindsey, were we betting about?

greetings - heinz -

Lindsey
January 4th, 2007, 11:58 PM
games? BETTING? what is going on in this forum? the worst part about your bet, lindsey, is probably
that you even won it.
LOL!! Well, I have to say, it's not the first time I've seen that question come up. And while it's been some time since I had to answer a TAPCIS question about that, the CompuServe software has the same sort of limitation, and the problem pops up on the Classic Help forum fairly regularly.

I guess I'm not surprised you're finding a higher incidence of those messages -- more and more people use HTML for e-mail these days.

--Lindsey

heinz57g
January 5th, 2007, 08:38 AM
the ratio of those weird mssgs used to be 1 in 50, as late (?) as in 2000, and is now easily
1 to 1 - and since they take up real s p a c e , it is more than a nuisance.

nothing can be done about this, as far as i am told. it is nice to see how the WWW 'improves'

greetings - heinz -

davidh
January 5th, 2007, 10:05 AM
the ratio of those weird mssgs used to be 1 in 50, as late (?) as in 2000, and is now easily
1 to 1 - and since they take up real s p a c e , it is more than a nuisance.

nothing can be done about this, as far as i am told. it is nice to see how the WWW 'improves'

greetings - heinz -

I used to get a fair amount of SPAM email on my Classic Compuserve account before I canceled it.

Spammers are now often putting words such as VIAGRA or OXYCONTIN, etc. into graphic image files to try to avoid spam filters. I.e. the word VIAGRA in text form appears nowhere in the message at all, only as part of an image in a JPG or GIF file. So they would have no reason to include a plain text part in a message. However, some are so brazen as to put a request in the plain text part requesting the reader to view the message with HTML enabled, perhaps even using mis-spelled English. Perhaps spam filters now pick up on these brazen requests too as a way to filter spam?

Of course it's also possible that legitimate correspondents may have their email software configured to omit the plain text part. However, my preference would probably be to call them ignorant bastards as opposed to legitimate :(

Back when I was naively convinced that I might keep using TAPCIS and Classic email 'forever', I wrote a tapcis macro to run on the messages that appear in the tapcis mail file telling you that the actual content is contained in C:\tapcis\dl\mail123.bin and convert the mail123.bin from HTML to plain text and store the plain text message in a TAPCIS message file for the purpose of making the text viewable with tapcis. However, since the level of spam on CS classic seemed to be increasing and since both myself and my wife had other (non-CS) mail accounts incompatible with TAPCIS, I decided the extra effort needed to make TAPCIS "keep up with the advance of technology" was futile.

However, TAPCIS does still have at least one significant advantage, namely, "security thru obsolescence" :)

DH

Lindsey
January 5th, 2007, 06:18 PM
nothing can be done about this, as far as i am told. it is nice to see how the WWW 'improves'
Not as long as you're using the HMI interface for mail, no. The remedy would be to go to a standard POP3 client, like Eudora, which would be able to read the HTML.

--Lindsey

heinz57g
January 7th, 2007, 03:26 PM
lindsey, i have said this before: this is after all a TAPCIS forum, and the section is called TAPCIS
SUPPORT. i am using enough other email sytems to know the difference, both positive and negative,
but please, if you'd go into a forum for painting collectors, and tell them a Van Gogh is not in focus
and a modern digital camera would do much better, they would hang you.

i am convinced you are right, basically, that other email systems would eliminate many of the issues
mentioned, but please also think about the many additional problems they bring. the above ''security
thru obsolescence'' only scratches the surface.

the readable mail to wrongly encoded mail ratio i mentioned was NOT refering to SPAM or similar,
but to regular emails from senders i know, and some of them trying to send pure ASCII, but being
blocked/changed/pressed knowingly/unknowingly into mssgs that turn out garbage. thats what i meant
with 'improvement'. the multitude of systems nowaday means, that even in the shortest of time such
perfect (yes, i said that) programs like FIREFOX will not be able to access WEB 2.0 or 3.0 mails.

but now I am wavering away from TAPCIS SUPPORT issues. 'cause what i was originally trying
to explain was ONLY why my MAILxxx.BIN files had reached 999 so quickly this (half-)year.

greetings - heinz -

Lindsey
January 7th, 2007, 04:56 PM
You implied a question as to whether there was anything to do about the MAILxxx.BIN problem; I was offering the best answer I knew. Even in the heyday of the TAPCIS forum, we never confined answers to only what could be done with TAPCIS.

being blocked/changed/pressed knowingly/unknowingly into mssgs that turn out garbage
Just because your mail system cannot read it does not mean that it is "garbage." I have found that using HTML for e-mail can be very useful, allowing me a better way of using formatting to help convey the message. I avoid using HTML when I know the recipient cannot read it, but people using e-mail systems that are incapable of reading HTML are very much in the minority these days.

the multitude of systems nowaday means, that even in the shortest of time such perfect (yes, i said that) programs like FIREFOX will not be able to access WEB 2.0 or 3.0 mails.

Do you mean HTML 2.0 or 3.0? I don't know of any browser or other HTML reader that is incapable of rendering the earliest versions of HTML. But HTML pages can always be saved as plain text. And even though there is a multitude of browsers, there's not a multitude of HTML standards.

--Lindsey

heinz57g
January 9th, 2007, 09:55 AM
lindsey, i am sometime far to TAPCIS-defending, i know that, and i am sorry for that.
and on the MAIL999.BIN issue you were right on. but mentioning EUDORA on the day
PEGASUS just gave up made me, well, sad.

with 'garbage' i certainly did not mean the contents, just the fact that TAPCIS sees it as such.
just a quick description, no more. and being in a minority, yes, i like that. with my emails it is
made easier (if not just possible at all) due to the fact that those particular mails i get and
send and file and sort and and and ARE just ASCII mails, 99% percent - so all the others are
usually spam or at least not from within my system. yes, it is special.

HTML? no, i really meant WEB 2.0 and 3.0 (being near ready), all those systems where the
borders and limits between messaging, chat, email, voice and pictures become so vague, if known
at all, that any of the present systems will be obsolete - and quickly. nobody will be able to know
where things are stored, what is real or what is in the web, what is on your computer, in hyperspace
or what is live ...

lets talk about this in 2 years only, ok?

greetings - heinz -

Lindsey
January 11th, 2007, 01:25 AM
Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to make you sad! It's very good of you to defend TAPCIS, and you know, there are still times that I miss it, too -- nothing feels as comfortable to me for being able to retrieve old e-mails as TAPCIS was. But there is a time and season for everything, as the preacher in Ecclesiastes said, and the season for TAPCIS is nearing its close, I fear.

HTML? no, i really meant WEB 2.0 and 3.0 (being near ready), all those systems where the borders and limits between messaging, chat, email, voice and pictures become so vague, if known at all, that any of the present systems will be obsolete - and quickly.
Oh, I see. Good point, but -- I think I won't worry about that for now. Sufficient to each day is the trouble thereof!

--Lindsey

heinz57g
January 11th, 2007, 04:23 AM
sad? yes, and mainly about the fact that a previously well working, reliable and almost fool-proof
system, with the greatest of potential, has been made into a joke. nothing to do with TAPCIS at all.

greetings - heinz -

Judy G. Russell
January 11th, 2007, 09:17 AM
sad? yes, and mainly about the fact that a previously well working, reliable and almost fool-proof
system, with the greatest of potential, has been made into a joke. nothing to do with TAPCIS at all.I think we're all sad about that, Heinz. Most of us came online when Compuserve was the only kid on the block, and then it became the Grey Lady of online services, and then it was torn down from the inside by those who thought they had to match what others were doing rather than continuing to do what only it was doing well. Sad indeed.