POP e-mail--arrghhh! [Archive]

dgermann

July 23rd, 2006, 09:13 PM

Hi--

Well, I managed to do a lot of hand editing and used davidh's ideas about spreadsheets and got a workable mail list imported into Evolution. I even see how I can use the same trick to import it into Thunderbird.

Now, I can't get either one to connect to CIS to collect my e-mail.

Or rather, I can't get Evo to do so, although it does work OK with ComCast. Thunderbird made one run to CIS, collected the e-mail, and now refuses to do it again.

Evo reports: "Failed to read a valid greeting from POP server pop.compuserve.com". This was after it sat there "waiting" for CIS probably over a minute.

What seems a big clue to me: neither program is asking for my CIS password, even tho both do for ComCast.

The changes I made in Thunderbird's set up, as far as I remember, related to unchecking "check my e-mail every 10 minutes," and telling it to leave the mail on the server for now. Those should not have stopped it working. I have tried about every security radio box it offers and no go.

Let me tell you what I have for Evo; maybe that will give us some clues (I am cutting and pasting, in case there is a typo someone else sees):

Account name: 76066.515@CompuServe.com
full name: doug
e-mail address: 76066.515@CompuServe.com
rely to: 76066.515@CompuServe.com
Org: [blank]
Sig: None

Server type: POP
Server: pop.compuserve.com
Username: 76066.515
Security: no encryption
Authentication type: password

Receiving options: only leave messages on server is checked

Sending Server type: SMTP
Server: smtp.compuserve.com
Security: TLS
Authentication: Plain
Username: 76066.515

So what am I missing?

BTW, I did check on CIS's site for instructions for setting up my e-mail client, and so help me, they really have it buried--could not find it at all.

In fact, I could not figure out how to login where it asks for my screen name and password. Right after that I did access my POP3 CIS account from both Yahoo and mail2web, so I think that says I have the right passwords and usernames--but no success on the CIS site. Weird!

Thanks for any help you can give me!

Lindsey

July 23rd, 2006, 10:02 PM

I would recommend posting a message in the "CompuServe Mail" section of the Classic CompuServe Support (http://community.compuserve.com/ws-cssoftware) Forum so that the experts there can help you troubleshoot your problem.

--Lindsey

dgermann

July 23rd, 2006, 10:48 PM

OK, Lindsey, will do.

Thanks!

ndebord

July 23rd, 2006, 11:40 PM

Hi--

Well, I managed to do a lot of hand editing and used davidh's ideas about spreadsheets and got a workable mail list imported into Evolution. I even see how I can use the same trick to import it into Thunderbird.

Now, I can't get either one to connect to CIS to collect my e-mail.

Or rather, I can't get Evo to do so, although it does work OK with ComCast. Thunderbird made one run to CIS, collected the e-mail, and now refuses to do it again.

Evo reports: "Failed to read a valid greeting from POP server pop.compuserve.com". This was after it sat there "waiting" for CIS probably over a minute.

What seems a big clue to me: neither program is asking for my CIS password, even tho both do for ComCast.

The changes I made in Thunderbird's set up, as far as I remember, related to unchecking "check my e-mail every 10 minutes," and telling it to leave the mail on the server for now. Those should not have stopped it working. I have tried about every security radio box it offers and no go.

Let me tell you what I have for Evo; maybe that will give us some clues (I am cutting and pasting, in case there is a typo someone else sees):

So what am I missing?

BTW, I did check on CIS's site for instructions for setting up my e-mail client, and so help me, they really have it buried--could not find it at all.

In fact, I could not figure out how to login where it asks for my screen name and password. Right after that I did access my POP3 CIS account from both Yahoo and mail2web, so I think that says I have the right passwords and usernames--but no success on the CIS site. Weird!

Thanks for any help you can give me!

I'm not sure, but I think you need to have it either check for email on startup or every xx amount of minutes. And then it "should" ask you for your password. It sounds like for some reason or another it is not saving that info and not actually trying to check for mail. Caveat. I've not used CIS for over a year now, so my memory of its foibles is totally hazy now.

davidh

July 24th, 2006, 12:33 AM

In fact, I could not figure out how to login where it asks for my screen name and password.

I don't know which (web) login screen you are talking about. In the past, there used to be some login screens that would accept classic ID's and some that would not.

If the (web) login screen that you are talking about is one that accepts classic ID's then you would use your numeric ID plus your classic login password (not email password) to login to that screen.

It might make a difference whether you use a period or a comma in your classic ID. As I remember, I used a comma in the middle of my numeric ID in TAPCIS but maybe a period (or a comma?) in screen name login's in compusserve web pages.

DH

davidh

July 24th, 2006, 12:48 AM

Doug, if you get really stuck and need to dig deep to find out what's going on, this may help.

http://www.tapcis.com/forums/showthread.php?p=22231#post22231

How to Telnet into a Mailbox in Order to Delete Large or Corrupt Messages

http://my.earthlink.net/mu/1/psc/img/walkthroughs/windows_9x_nt/email/oe_5.0/0647.CantGetEmail.psc.html

DH

Another thing that might be worth checking is to run TAPCIS or WINCIM to look at BUT NOT download the mail. Just to make sure that the mail that you expect to be in the mail box is really there and not stuck, etc.

Furthermore you might want to keep a copy of TAPCIS or WINCIM installed and workable on some PC somewhere, just in case your CS mailbox gets kerflubbled.

dgermann

July 24th, 2006, 10:29 AM

ndebord--

Thanks! I think I tried that check every 10 minutes stuff, but will check again. Don't remember what all I tried in the probably 3 hours I spent sweating over it!

I do know I asked it to make a specific run for the mail, and that is where it got hung up....

david--

The place I was trying to login was something like this: https://my.screenname.aol.com/_cqr/login/login.psp?mcState=initialized&seamless=novl&siteId=vatlascsus&siteState=OrigUrl%3dhttp%253a%252f%252fcsmail.comp userve.com%252f_cqr%252fvllogin.adp%26RefUrl%3dhtt p%253a%252f%252fwebsearch.cs.com%252fcs%252fsearch %253ffromPage%253dcccscomsearch%2526query%253demai l%252bsetup%2526x%253d0%2526y%253d0&authLev=2

Now I am wondering if there is a third set of names and passwords: one for dialup and direct connect, such as to retrieve e-mail; one for that screen I show above; and one to pick up POP3 e-mail?

Thanks! You are most helpful and knowledgeable!

davidh

July 24th, 2006, 02:22 PM

The place I was trying to login was something like this: https://my.screenname.aol.com/_cqr/login/login.psp?mcState=initialized&seamless=novl&siteId=vatlascsus&siteState=OrigUrl%3dhttp%253a%252f%252fcsmail.comp userve.com%252f_cqr%252fvllogin.adp%26RefUrl%3dhtt p%253a%252f%252fwebsearch.cs.com%252fcs%252fsearch %253ffromPage%253dcccscomsearch%2526query%253demai l%252bsetup%2526x%253d0%2526y%253d0&authLev=2

Now I am wondering if there is a third set of names and passwords: one for dialup and direct connect, such as to retrieve e-mail; one for that screen I show above; and one to pick up POP3 e-mail?

Doug,

my.screenname.aol.com is the main login page(s) for AOL instant messenger screen names. I don't have a classic ID anymore so I don't know whether classic ID validations on the web also go thru that page now or not.

I still have an AOL Instant Messenger ID (AIM ID) that I use to access Compuserve / Netscape forums. For example, when I post a message in the Compuserve forums. It often happens during such logins to post a message in a Compuserve forums that I have to login twice, once on a Compuserve login page and then subsequently on my.screenname.aol.com. So I guess that the login process is not as smooth as it should be.

I think I remember this problem of having to log in twice also happening when I still had a classic CIS ID (numeric ID).

Your POP ID and password for compuserve are separate from your Classic login ID. However, in your case apparently you are using your numeric Classic ID as your POP ID too (as opposed to having got a personalized POP3 ID). This dual use of numeric ID is not really a problem at all. Anyway, your POP3 password for POP3 Classic mail should be different from your Classic login password. (I don't know if it's possible to FORCE Classic login password and Classic POP3 password to be identical or not, but it would not be a good idea to do so.)

Bottom line is that for Classic CIS users there are only two sets of ID+password, which you already are using and already know about. That's all.

If you wanted to use the relatively new AIM email (web based like Yahoo mail) service you'd have to get a new screen name for that purpose. However, Yahoo web mail and Gmail web mail are likely better than AIM mail. I have had an AIM screen name ever since Compuserve was bought by AOL and they came out with CSIM (Compuserve Instant Messenger same as AIM). However I have not bothered to try out AIM mail account available automatically with my screen name.

I have decided not to use any ISP email address as my main email address because I've changed ISP's so many times I know I'm likely to change again. Instead I have two permanent email addresses, one from Google, and the other from Cornell University. I just set both of my permanent email servers up to forward mail to my current ISP email account. So I only have to go to Google to make a single change using online menus when I ever change my ISP. Google mail can also be read easily at Internet cafe's, etc. when you travel.

BTW, I think that Compuserve only bills you for minutes during use of Compuserve protocols. So, for example, if you read your Compuserve POP3 email using Evolution, you will not get charged any minutes. Therefore if you stop using TAPCIS, you would be able to keep your Compuserve email address and use only the lowest level of Classic membership. There used to be 4 levels, $24.95 (unlimited), $9.95, $4.95 (lite), $2.95 (payasyougo). Since you will never use any minutes if you use only POP3, you might as well go with the payasyougo plan if it's still available. You may have to ask to speak to a supervisor or threaten to cancel your account to get the info about payasyougo. It gives you 60 minutes per month (which you'd never use).

It would be a good idea to keep WINCIM or CS4 installed on one of you PC's as long as you have CIS, just in case you need to check your minutes usage (in case they overbill you) or clear a problem out in your CIS mail account.

There used to be scripts for TAPCIS that would let you check your minutes usage, but at this point in time you'd probably not wish to bother investing additional time in working on Compuserve things.

DH

Gary Maltzen

July 24th, 2006, 05:09 PM

my.screenname.aol.com ... I don't know whether classic ID validations on the web also go thru that page now or not.Classic validation has never used that page. Each Classic service (HMI, HTTP, POP3) uses it's own validation process.
to post a message in a Compuserve forums that I have to login twice, once on a Compuserve login page and then subsequently on my.screenname.aol.com.You must be using community.compuserve.com -- I use community.netscape.com with my AOL/AIM screenname and only login once.
Your POP ID and password for compuserve are separate from your Classic login ID.The POP3 server looks at the format of the username and, if it is two numbers separated by a comma (UIN), goes directly to the UIN database -- otherwise it passes the supplied username through a "translation" server (which seems sometimes be overloaded) in order to get the UIN to use for lookup.
I don't know if it's possible to FORCE Classic login password and Classic POP3 password to be identical or notThe Classic login password MUST have at least one special character (i.e., secret*phrase) whereas the POP3 password must consist ONLY of letters AND digits (i.e., pop3password).
I have decided not to use any ISP email address as my main email address because I've changed ISP's so many times I know I'm likely to change again. Instead I have two permanent email addresses, one from Google, and the other from Cornell University. The only (IMO) "permanent" e-mail address is with a domain you own and manage. That said I have one e-mail address that has been constant since 1990; search on my name and you will find it as I used it publicly long before spam was on the horizon.

Note that the PAYG Classic billing ($0/month, $2.95/hour) has only been offered to members who migrate from Classic to CS2000.

davidh

July 24th, 2006, 05:48 PM

Gary,

Thanks for filling in the details about some of the uncertainties I had in my post.

Note that the PAYG Classic billing ($0/month, $2.95/hour) has only been offered to members who migrate from Classic to CS2000.

Back in about late 2004 I switched from the Classic $9.95 plan to the $2.95/mo.+$2.50/hr above 1 hr. pay as you go plan WITHOUT ever getting involved with CS2000. Whether this situation still holds true today or not, I don't know. I stayed on the Payasyougo plan for several months before I finally cancelled Classic service completely.

Perhaps this option is still open today. Some recent news stories have claimed that AOL is considering making more of its services available for free, so AOL keeping the payasyougo plan would not be inconsistent with this newer approach. I would think that keeping customers, even at a minimal subscription level, would increase the probablity that even such customers would visit Compuserve pages and click on ads more often

BTW, for anyone else who might read this message, the Compuserve Customer Support phone numbers, etc. (incl. international) can be found at:

http://webcenters.netscape.compuserve.com/menu/cust.jsp?floc=DC-headnav2

DH

dgermann

July 24th, 2006, 09:50 PM

David and Gary--

Thanks for filling me in--I was planning on checking on pricing options soon--if I can get this e-mail to work.

Actually, I can login to CIS for forum work. There I use my 76066.515 address (doesn't matter if comma or dot) and password1; I can get POP3 e-mail from Mail2Web using either my--what did they call them--vanity name and password2 or my 766066.515 and password2. From Yahoo mail I use my vanity name and not sure what password I have given it, probably password2.

The folks on Classic help seem to indicate that where I was logging in was not supported for classic mail, FWIW.

Thanks for your continuing to help, David, Gary! :)

Gary Maltzen

July 25th, 2006, 02:39 PM

The folks on Classic help seem to indicate that where I was logging in was not supported for classic mail, FWIW.
FWIW, I am also helping you in the forum.
What you call "password2" we call "POP3 mail-only password" as that is the ONLY function of that password.

dgermann

July 25th, 2006, 09:43 PM

Gary--

Oh! Did not realize that was you!

Thank you for all the help. You are sure sticking with me, and I appreciate that. I am really lost on this one.

I am beginning to see the difference in the two passwords, and apparently there is a third for those who want to chat or something else. Thanks.

Lindsey

July 25th, 2006, 10:09 PM

The folks on Classic help seem to indicate that where I was logging in was not supported for classic mail, FWIW.
I think you're referring to the main CompuServe home page -- the e-mail link there is only for CS2000 accounts.

--Lindsey

davidh

July 26th, 2006, 09:08 AM

I am beginning to see the difference in the two passwords, and apparently there is a third for those who want to chat or something else. Thanks.

Doug,

There is only a MAXIMUM of TWO id/pw combinations on a Classic account and you know about them already (Classic service login and POP3 email login).

AOL also has several OTHER pay-for services and several OTHER free services and they all use what are called "screen names". After you sign up for one of the FREE services you can also use that free screen name on many other FREE services.

Among the PAY-FOR services are:

1. AOL

2. Compuserve 2000

3. Netscape ISP (isp.netscape.com)

4. Walmart ISP

If you happen to have one of these pay-for services, you can also use that screen name for many free services too.

Among the free services are:

1. AIM (AOL Instant Messenger) which recently also added free web-based email

2. Netscape web-based email

3. ICQ instant messaging type service

4. Netscape/Compuserve Prospero forums

5. various kinds of "groups" on AOL or Compuserve 2000, etc. To be the owner of one of these various kinds of groups you may or may not have to be a paying member of AOL or CS2000. However people with free screen names can also join such groups for free.

There are too many combinations and permutations for me to make an exhaustive description and there's a lot I don't know about it anyway.

Bottom line is that Classic Compuserve is now basically just EMAIL and connectivity to the Internet. (But of course, you can still use your classic numeric ID to post in Netscape Propero forums but they are officially Netscape forums now, except for the two Compuserve support forums, Classic and CS2000.) There may be a few other services such as Classic private forums and Classic (non-forum) chat that possibly still work on Classic compuserve but I doubt more than a relatively few people know about them or use them.

There is no third password or ID for Classic accounts. However if you ever want to talk about the many AOL services outside of Classic CIS, then the possibilities for ID's and passwords are "infinite".

DH

davidh

July 26th, 2006, 09:18 AM

Doug,

I don't know if you missed my post about how to diagnose a POP3 email mail box and connection. But if you did, here it is again. You might want to save it for future reference in case you need it again.

http://my.earthlink.net/mu/1/psc/img/walkthroughs/windows_9x_nt/email/oe_5.0/0647.CantGetEmail.psc.html

I haven't been following your posts in the Classic Compuserve forum in detail, but I noticed that somebody else there also recommended this diagnostic technique to you there. I believe that this URL link gives more detailed info about how to do this type of diagnosis. If you can't get into your Classic pop3 email account using telnet, then it is almost certain that you will never be able to get into it until you figure out how to make it work with telnet.

The advantage of telnet is that there is no hidden configuration information "hidden under the hood" that could be screwed up. That is, you type everything EXPLICITLY at the keyboard.

DH

dgermann

July 26th, 2006, 11:39 AM

Lindsey--

Thank you. I think you are right about that. But they sure don't make it easy to find how to login. Perhaps it is because us Classic people are such strange birds. But I prefer to think of us as Classy. :D

David--

Ahh, infinite! Yes, indeedy. That is part of why it is hard to know where to login for what.

Yes, I did previously follow along with that earthlink url you sent. I have a Win95 machine which has screens that look like that, but I think I missed a step, now that I look at it again. I will try it there, too, again.

I tried to translate what I saw there into linux command lines, and have been following Gary's able advice there. As you observed, I have not been able to reliably connect via telnet. I think that is a clue that there is a connection issue, rather than an e-mail client configuration issue. Gary is not so sure.

Your point about telnet being all out in the open and nothing hidden under the hood is good to realize.

I sure hope there is some way to do this e-mail.

Thanks for all of your help, David!

Lindsey

July 26th, 2006, 11:05 PM

But they sure don't make it easy to find how to login. Perhaps it is because us Classic people are such strange birds. But I prefer to think of us as Classy.
We are, unfortunately, CompuServe's red-headed stepchildren these days. :(

--Lindsey

Judy G. Russell

July 27th, 2006, 12:11 AM

We are, unfortunately, CompuServe's red-headed stepchildren these days. :( These days???

davidh

July 27th, 2006, 02:41 AM

Ahh, infinite! Yes, indeedy. That is part of why it is hard to know where to login for what.

Yes, I did previously follow along with that earthlink url you sent. I have a Win95 machine which has screens that look like that, but I think I missed a step, now that I look at it again. I will try it there, too, again.

I tried to translate what I saw there into linux command lines, and have been following Gary's able advice there. As you observed, I have not been able to reliably connect via telnet. I think that is a clue that there is a connection issue, rather than an e-mail client configuration issue. Gary is not so sure.

Doug,
One way that you can test whether your TELNET skills are getting tuned up to par is to try to TELNET into gateway.compuserve.com , instead of pop.compuserve.com

The difference with gateway.compuserve.com is that you are supposed to use port 4144 (CIS TELENT) or port 23 (standard TELNET) instead of port 110
(POP3).

Also, at gateway.compuserve.com you must use your numeric ID and your compuserve ISP login password (not your pop3 email-only password).

If you can login ok to gateway.compuserve.com but NOT to pop.compuserve.com that would be stronger evidence that there is a problem somewhere besides in your email set up on your linux PC.

It could also be a problem with your firewall or with your router (if you use one).

I have had an intermittent problem with my firewall, such that I had to uninstall it and reinstall it because it was blocking access to certain web sites. The problem is pretty complicated and I still don't understand it 100%. But it had to do with the subnet mask of the OS for the TCP/IP protocol on the ethernet card not matching the subnet mask for the same card in the configuration of the firewall. One possible fix was to use IPCONFIG.EXE to RELEASE and then RENEW the adapter. IPCONFIG.EXE is a command line text-based program so there is probably a similar utility for LINUX.

If you are comfortable working with command line programs in LINUX you may also get some useful info from running TRACERT and from running NETSTAT (in another console screen). I don't know if LINUX uses the same command names or not.

As far as login to CIS I think the only place you would need to do that would be in TAPCIS or http://community.compuserve.com forums or possibly in WINCIM if you have that installed. Normally I don't even log in to compuserve unless I'm already in a particular forum (e.g. Internet Explorer forum) and in the process of posting a message. So you probably should just always ignore all other web based compuserve login screens.

DH

Lindsey

July 28th, 2006, 10:54 PM

These days???
I guess it's been for rather a long while, at that. :(

--Lindsey

Judy G. Russell

July 29th, 2006, 01:53 PM

I guess it's been for rather a long while, at that. :( Certainly since AOL took the place over and started ignoring classic in favor of "eyeballs".

dgermann

August 2nd, 2006, 12:01 PM

davidh

August 3rd, 2006, 08:40 AM

Hi folks--

Some headway to report.

Last evening I was able to bypass the router and hook directly to the modem. And I was able to connect to CIS without difficulty and download my mail. Telnet worked every time, too.

So the trick now will be to figure out how to burrow through the router.

They offer two settings on the Linksys website: one is a setting for MTU; another is to open trigger ports 25 and 113. I have done the ports as they say, and the setting for MTU seems to be where it needs to be after running some specialized ping tests (1500).

If anybody has any suggestions, they would sure be welcome! ;)

Thanks for holding my hand on this! If you got the router and the modem from your ISP, I'd hope that the router was preconfigured to let common protocols such as SMTP and POP3 go thru on standard port numbers.

I know very little about LINUX, but if I were you and also had a Windows PC handy, I think I would hook the Windows PC to the router and see if I could telnet into all the POP3 servers you use. (You probably would have Internet Explorer along with Outlook Express installed on the Windows PC and could set up OE to get mail from those POP3 servers, but you might not want to bother messing with OE.)

It seems strange to me that I thought you said that Evolution could POP email from another POP3 server but not from the Compuserve POP3 server.

I use the HOSTS file in Windows to block ads from certain sites. In addition to blocking browser access to certain sites, the HOSTS file could be set up to block ANY site/address on the Internet, including particular POP3 servers.

Firewalls can also be set up to block things.

In addition to INTENTIONAL blocking of addresses and/or protocols on the Internet, there could also be accidental blocking due to bugs and/or mis-configurations somewhere in the network in the PC's and/or router.

Anyway, if you can telnet to BOTH POP3 servers thru the router from your Windows PC, then it would seem the problem is in the LINUX PC somewhere. Seems like first priority is to narrow the problem down to either the LINUX box or the router box, no?

DH

dgermann

August 6th, 2006, 01:18 PM

David--

If you can login ok to gateway.compuserve.com but NOT to pop.compuserve.com that would be stronger evidence that there is a problem somewhere besides in your email set up on your linux PC.

It could also be a problem with your firewall or with your router (if you use one).

David--Yes I can login to gateway.compuserve.com, just not pop. Strange, huh?

Yes, I do have a router. Bypassing the router and the network switch bypasses the problem--then I can use Thunderbird and telnet without problem.

If you are comfortable working with command line programs in LINUX you may also get some useful info from running TRACERT and from running NETSTAT (in another console screen). I don't know if LINUX uses the same command names or not.

Yes, I have run multiple tracerts to pop.compuserve.com from the router and from various machines and even using the Princeton site. Sometimes from my machines they go through (I think they always go through from the router), sometimes not, and always from Princeton.

I can telnet to other pop sites such as yahoo and comcast.

If you got the router and the modem from your ISP,

Modem from the ISP, router from a local dealer.

I know very little about LINUX, but if I were you and also had a Windows PC handy, I think I would hook the Windows PC to the router and see if I could telnet into all the POP3 servers you use. (You probably would have Internet Explorer along with Outlook Express installed on the Windows PC and could set up OE to get mail from those POP3 servers, but you might not want to bother messing with OE.)

Tried that: WindowsXP Pro has the same problems with telnet as the other computers, and the problems go away when the router and switch are removed. Switch seems to be working for all other network traffic. OE is not on the WinXp box--never could figure out how to set it up, so any Win box I get, I delete it day one.

Didn't know you could use hosts. to block websites. Good piece of info, David.

I have a firewall on each machine, and it makes no difference whether it is enabled or disabled. On linux it gives reports of blocked attempts to come in and go out and it reports nothing.

You can see why everyone seems so perplexed by this, yes? I have posted on two forums on Compuserve (Classic and Hardware) and on Comcasts forum, asked the Linksys people via e-mail, and a couple of Linux websites as well. Have tried all their suggestions, and nothing seems to work. What we need is for somebody to come up with an out of left-field suggestion!

That said, I think it points to a problem in the router. But Linksys is giving hints they are going to start pointing the finger at comcast....

Thanks, David, for continuing to puzzle over this one with me!

davidh

August 6th, 2006, 03:56 PM

I wonder if there is some way to open up the router and jumper it temporarily back to the factory configuration, just in case it somehow got configured wrong at some point in time?

I stopped using DSL because I'm cheap and did not want a whole year contract. But since I kept the original DSL contract with Verizon for one whole year I did not have to return the box (router switch modem combo). Maybe your ISP would let you trade in your modem for such a combo? Then you could just retire the Linksys router or return it?

Also, if you haven't done so yet, you might try to telnet or browse into your router to see how it's configured. Just telnet to xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx or web_browse to http://xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx where the x's stand for the IP address of the router. Older boxes used telnet , newer ones use http, I think.

There are other things you could play with:

changing DNS server addresses (use comcast, use compuserve, use whoever, use alternates, etc. But since you can telnet to mail server without router, this probably won't help.)

checking the subnet masks of everything (e.g. see if you can look at this in the router by browsing into it, check subnet masks in OS's networking, etc. etc.)

is your IP static or dynamic, if it's dynamic maybe you can figure out how to release the IP address and renew it and see if you get another one (IP) different and then try again with router and mail server

just grasping at straws, you know

DH

dgermann

August 9th, 2006, 09:12 PM

David--

Thanks for grasping at straws for me, David!

Was off line a couple days, so sorry I did not respond to you earlier.

The saga continues: Was offline because Linksys's tech said to try a firmware upgrade. I did, and lost all connectivity. After 3 hours of tech service calls ending at about 1:20 pm, the last tech gave me an RMA number to return it!

Today I just went out and bought another WRT54G, this one ver 6 (old one was ver 5).

Guess what? Still can only connect to CIS one time in 10 or so (I think that might be an improvement). Also the install was fairly uneventful--only needed to call tech service to get the router moved from 192.168.1.1 to 192.168.0.1.

I'm on cable--never did have DSL.

A telnet connection to the router is refused, but I have all along been using the web interface.

This evening did a couple releases and renewals of ipaddresses from the Win95 box (ipconfig\release or \renew)--not sure what the commands would be from the linux box.

Thanks for your help, David.

Someone on the Classic Compuserve forum thinks it may be CIS at fault--he has run some tests I don't understand.

It may be easier to just dump CIS and go through the change of e-mail addresses with everyone!

Sign me

Still looking for some ideas.

davidh

August 10th, 2006, 01:44 AM

This evening did a couple releases and renewals of ipaddresses from the Win95 box (ipconfig\release or \renew)--not sure what the commands would be from the linux box.

If you do the release and renew from Win95 while going thru the router, then it is likely you are getting the exact same IP address assigned to your Win 95 PC each and every time. That is, it's likely that when you do the renew it's using DHCP (protocol) to ask for it's own IP address and the router is answering back with an address on the 192.168.xxx.xxx subnet for the 95 box to use as its own IP address. However if you have a dynamic IP assigned to you by the cable co. then if you can figure out how to do a release and renew IN THE ROUTER ITSELF (thru the router's web interface), then you would possibly get a new different IP address (not on the Win 95 box) but as an IP address that the outside world on the Intenet would see you at.

Then you can go to www.grc.com or other sites to find out what is your IP address on the Internet (not on your home network). Run shields up at grc.com.

There are ways to fake your IP address to see if pop.compuserve.com would react differently if your own IP was different, but this is technical. (I'm thinking the onion router might work, but it may not be worth installing and learning this software. Used mostly to protect your ID on the net.)

Even if you have a dynamic IP address from the cable co. and even if the IP address changes when you release and renew (with your ISP not on your internal home net) the addresses should be similar , I think, regardless of whether you use the router or take the router out and go direct to the modem. You could verify this at grc.com. Normally only the low order digits of the IP address from cable co. should vary when doing release and renew of dymanic IP "lease". If this is NOT the case then it might have something to do with the router messing pop up but modem alone popping ok.

Perhaps you can find a webmail service free or cheap that would pop your compuserve mail and forward it to your pop mail box on your ISP. I don't know if google does this. It forwards, but I don't know if it pops AND forwards. You can pop google but i don't know if google webmail will also pop other mail servers, never looked into it. It might be worth while to do this while you phase out CIS. If you pay CIS $25 or $10/mo. now, you could drop to $5 or $3 /mo. during the phase out to give you time to switch people to your new address. Maybe take the saving to pay for special webmail service for a few months during transition? (Offhand I don't have any co.s to recommend.) I started with NETCOM ISP (now Earthlink) in 1995 and never used CIS as my main Internet connection. Just used TAPCIS for email and forums from 1996. Even tho' I started CIS in 1983 I was stupid and only used it as pay as you go with DOSCIM and ASCII interface (me stupid!). Used to use teletype to login in to CIS sometimes in 1983.

DH

DH

Gary Maltzen

August 11th, 2006, 06:44 PM

Was off line a couple days, so sorry I did not respond to you earlier.Just back from two weeks vacation, I see you are still having problems.... and bought another WRT54G...Still can only connect to CIS one time in 10 or so...call tech service to get the router moved from 192.168.1.1 to 192.168.0.1.Why did you need to change the (I presume) LAN subnet? Are you using fixed IP addresses on your LAN?A telnet connection to the router is refused, but I have all along been using the web interface.The WRT54G has never supported a telnet interface, only a web interface. I have an older (v1.1, upgraded firmware) model sitting here.Still looking for some ideas.Does the WRT54G connect to some sort of cable modem?

earler

August 12th, 2006, 11:59 AM

The ver 5 of that router has been problematic for many, mainly for voip usage. As far as I know, all those linksys come with a default address of 192.168.1.1. Best to change it to 192.168.0.1 and to change the password from 'admin'.

Logging on the CompuServe from the internet has nothing to do with the router but with the routine itself.

It also matters not if you are connecting through cable or adsl.

-er

dgermann

August 13th, 2006, 05:29 PM

earler, Gary and David--

earler--Yikes. My next project was to try to get Skype up and running. So you're telling me to ditch Linksys entirely!?

Gary--

Yes, it's a Motorola SB 5100 Surfboard cable modem. You will find the latest of the conversation over on the PC Hardware forum.

Changing the ipaddress internally: I wanted to do the change earler suggested. My internal network is on 192.168.0.X, while Linksys defaults to 192.168.1.X. Rather than have to manually reconfigure 9 or 10 computers, all of which are set to static ipaddresses, I thought it would be easier to reset the router to 192.168.0.1. It wasn't as easy as I thought.

I counted up yesterday. I tried to get Evolution to connect to CIS POP3. It took 28 tries in a row before I finally got a response back from CIS asking for my password. Then the download of the e-mail went ok.

David--

My old ipaddress was 67.185.234.XXX; my new one is 71.193.X.X. I am on Comcast, so they might have a wider range of ipaddress blocks than smaller ISPs.

I have been looking for free services that both grab POP and forward; haven't found any with names I recognize, so I am leery. Also, CIS doesn't forward; Comcast does not automatically grab POP3 e-mail. It might be worth paying Mail2Web or Yahoo for the service--saw one in the $10 annual range. Certainly reasonable for the time necessary to make a switchover.

Thanks guys!

:- Doug.

Gary Maltzen

August 14th, 2006, 10:23 AM

Changing the ipaddress internally: I wanted to do the change earler suggested. My internal network is on 192.168.0.X, while Linksys defaults to 192.168.1.X. Rather than have to manually reconfigure 9 or 10 computers, all of which are set to static ipaddresses, I thought it would be easier to reset the router to 192.168.0.1. It wasn't as easy as I thought.This leads me to wonder if your individual systems might have routing or DNS configuration errors. Note that ISPs are prone to change DNS servers on occasion.

Is there a particular reason for static IP addresses on your network?

Assuming there is, it is also possible to assign an additional static IP address to a network adapter with a primary DHCP address. The virtue of using a DHCP-assigned address is that the automatic assignment includes routing and DNS configurations. For example my internal "mailhost" server has DHCP-assigned address of 192.168.23.101 as well as a static IP of 192.168.23.80.

Win2K and WinXP allow up to five additional static IP addresses per adapter; Linux allows (at least) 255 per adapter.

earler

August 14th, 2006, 10:51 AM

It's often problematic to use static addresses on your local internet. Can't you enable dhcp?

The linksys routers are usually good. It's only the model 5 that has had problems. As for skype, it isn't really voip in the sense it uses a proprietary peer-to-peer method for communications rather than sip as voip normally does. Worse, skype uses resources on your computer to handle other calls than yours. This makes it cheaper for skype since it doesn't need to have all those servers tied up. Frankly, I don't much like skype for this reason and because it ties you to the computer, and usually a mike and earphones. With normal voip, all you need to have on is the router, and the broadband connection of course.

-er

dgermann

August 14th, 2006, 10:39 PM

er--

Don't know whether that bodes well or ill for my trying to use Skype. Have a few friends on Skype who have been encouraging me to get it. Do the other voip services connect with it? Don't know anything about voip....

er and Gary--

Only have static ipaddresses because that's the way they were set up for me by my technician, long since gone. I know nothing of dhcp vs static, except that...well except not a thing.

I like being able to know that X computer is at 104, another at 105 another at 106, and don't like the idea that the server might scramble them next time it boots up. For instance, I have some launchers on the linux desktop that launch "vncviewer 192.168.0.104", and I would hate to have to reset those for everybody every time the computer decided it no longer liked 104 for that computer.

Also, dhcp sounds more complicated to me.

What do I need to know to choose correctly, if you please?

Thanks, guys, for caring.

earler

August 15th, 2006, 09:21 AM

Skype uses a proprietary peer to peer method for communications. It is by no means compatible with voip, which uses sip (session initialization protocol), a standard throughout the world. I can see skype of interest for kids who are on their computers and don't mind using earphones and a microphone or for people living in countries where not even voip is practical.

As for dhcp versus static addresses, note that once a computer gets an address through dhcp it doesn't change unless the computer is disconnected for several days. It continues with the same address. And it really makes no difference to users if they are at 104 or 105 or another number within the private address world of the internal network. I think you are confusing the use of static versus dynamic addresses for the public one that ones network shows to the world. That is another matter, one that doesn't really matter either unless one is running a web, mail or other type of server within ones private network.

Dhcp is not complicated for the user. It merely assigns addresses and requires no intervention by the users.

-er

Gary Maltzen

August 15th, 2006, 09:41 AM

I've just been discussing the DHCP-vs-static IP issue with FrankB in Linuxforum.

I, for example, run this (SuSE Linux 10.0) system with two IP addresses:
* 192.168.23.10x - assigned by DHCP
* 192.168.23.71 - static
The advantage is that the (Linksys router) DHCP carries with it routing and DNS information.
(Yet I can still use FTP or VNC to connect to ***.71)

DHCP is actually *less* complicated; you just turn it on and the systems take care of themselves.

And, as Earle points out, the DHCP addresses will be 'sticky'. Most routers tend to allocate a DHCP address for 24 hours.
The client will re-request the IP after 1/2 the allocated time has elapsed, thus hanging onto the IP address for as long as possible.

Multiple IP addresses has always been possible in Linux; in WIndows it became possible starting with (IIRC) WinNT.

dgermann

August 15th, 2006, 10:27 AM

Earle and Gary--

You are making it clearer for me! Thanks!

I am even almost willing to make the switch to dynamic from static. It seems you are telling me that it will make life easier for me. Yes?

Here is my set-up:

3 users
1 redhat 9.0 server running samba
4 ubuntu 6.06 workstations (2 are main workstations, 1 runs backups, 1 is a spare machine)
1 winxp pro workstation (the third main workstation)
2 win95 workstations

The win95 boxes (maybe they were the reason we went to static ip addresses?) are running two essential apps, until we can get a linux alternative: timeslips/R and quickbooks/R. The time and billing is more essential, the quickbooks functions as just a glorified payables listing.

So how do I do both dynamic and static ipaddresses? I see the gui frontend in ubuntu only allows a choice between dhcp and static, so I would guess I need to use a command line tool. I usually prefer command line to gui. And what is done in winxp?

Is it possible to have the win95 boxes be static and everything else dhcp? It seems to me at least one dhcp switch is set to on in my router controls.