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Dodi Schultz
June 4th, 2014, 09:55 AM
When you send a word in /italics/ [that word was in italics], why does
GoogleGroups put a slash at each side?

While I'm at it: Why does GoogleGroups turn almost everything into Courier?
(Not everything; it seems to be sort of selective.)

--Dodi

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Daniel Widdis
June 4th, 2014, 10:32 AM
On Wed Jun 4 07:55:32 2014, Dodi Schultz wrote:
>
> When you send a word in /italics/ [that word was in italics], why does
> GoogleGroups put a slash at each side?

I actually think this is Thunderbird doing it, not GoogleGroups.

TBird, by default, will send a formatted message in two different
formats, HTML (the formatting language of the web) where it will render
your word <i>italics</i>, <b>bold</b>, and <u>underscore</u> and plain
text, where it will add characters around /italics/, *bold*, and
_underscore_ according to a longstanding informal standard on text-only
mailing lists.

If the recipient is HTML-capable, they typically only see the HTML
version of the message. If not, they see the text version, with the
HTML as an attachment (back when you still used your TAPCIS client for
email, you saw these regularly).

TBird, displaying a message for reading, also helpfully puts words it
finds between slashes back into italics. It also leaves the slashes
there so it ends up being redundant!

GoogleGroups itself is just (usually) passing on emails it receives in
whatever format it gets them.

Interestingly, this mail you just sent arrived in text-only format with
no HTML. It may be that you have it configured to send text-only to
the Dixonary group if you originate a message, but you use the same
text/HTML format as another message when you reply to it.

> While I'm at it: Why does GoogleGroups turn almost everything into
> Courier? (Not everything; it seems to be sort of selective.)

It doesn't. That also is a setting of your client. This may be how
you have chosen to see text-only messages.

Dan

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Dodi Schultz
June 4th, 2014, 11:10 AM
I sent my message in HTML. I don't send messages to the group any
differently than I do to anyone. When your message arrived, I saw it in
Courier. Here in the reply screen, it's in Verdana (the font I mainly use).
In the paragraph beginning "TBird, by default", the words in question
appear at first in regular text with markup notations (<i>italics</i>,
etc.) and then in the next line with GG's indications (/italics/, but not
actually in italics, etc.).

Anyway: Thanks, Dan. I'm not sure I totally understand, but . . .

Now I'm wondering how it deals with colors, if at all. My correspondents
can see colors. I wonder if GG can. This sentence is in blue. This one's in
red. And this one's in green.

I don't really expect any rainbows. :-)

--Dodi

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

On 6/4/2014 11:32 AM, Dan Widdis wrote:
> On Wed Jun 4 07:55:32 2014, Dodi Schultz wrote:
>>
>> When you send a word in /italics/ [that word was in italics], why does
>> GoogleGroups put a slash at each side?
>
> I actually think this is Thunderbird doing it, not GoogleGroups.
>
> TBird, by default, will send a formatted message in two different
> formats, HTML (the formatting language of the web) where it will render
> your word <i>italics</i>, <b>bold</b>, and <u>underscore</u> and plain
> text, where it will add characters around /italics/, *bold*, and
> _underscore_ according to a longstanding informal standard on text-only
> mailing lists.
>
> If the recipient is HTML-capable, they typically only see the HTML
> version of the message. If not, they see the text version, with the HTML
> as an attachment (back when you still used your TAPCIS client for email,
> you saw these regularly).
>
> TBird, displaying a message for reading, also helpfully puts words it
> finds between slashes back into italics. It also leaves the slashes there
> so it ends up being redundant!
>
> GoogleGroups itself is just (usually) passing on emails it receives in
> whatever format it gets them.
>
> Interestingly, this mail you just sent arrived in text-only format with
> no HTML. It may be that you have it configured to send text-only to the
> Dixonary group if you originate a message, but you use the same text/HTML
> format as another message when you reply to it.
>
>


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Daniel Widdis
June 4th, 2014, 11:29 AM
On 6/4/14, 9:10 AM, Dodi Schultz wrote:
>
> I sent my message in HTML.
You might think you did, but the message content (if I click "show
original" on GGroups or "view message source" on Tbird) contains only
the text version with "Content-type: text/plain". Contrast this to most
of the other group messages (like this one) which contain both the
text/plain and the same message a second time in "Content-Type: text/html".
> I don't send messages to the group any differently than I do to anyone.
You may type them the same, but they are being sent from your client
differently.
> When your message arrived, I saw it in Courier.
Because I replied to a plaintext-only message, my reply was
plaintext-only because of my default settings. I have specifically
changed this reply to send in both plaintext and HTML, so you should see
it in your default (Verdana) rather than courier. And you should see
these /italics/, *bold*, and _underlined text_ rendered properly, with
none of the slashes or asterisks or underscore characters.

> Anyway: Thanks, Dan. I'm not sure I totally understand, but . . .
Try this. Go to your Thunderbird preferences (I think, on Windows,
you'll go to Tools > Options; for me on my mac it's Thunderbird >
Preferences). Click on the "Composition" tab. Near the bottom of that
screen should be a line to "Configure text format behavior" with a
button "Send Options". Click that. Then check your settings. Mine
are to "Send the message in both plain text and HTML" and both the
"Plain Text Domains" and "HTML Domains" are blank. Are yours configured
similarly?

Also I have an "Options" menu when composing a message, which allows me
to set "Delivery Format". I usually have it on "Auto Detect" which
replies to text-only with text-only, and HTML with HTML. For this
message, I specifically chose "Plain and Rich (HTML) Text".

It also may be that your address book entry for Dixonary may be flagged
"prefers to receive messages as plain text". Try editing your address
book to see if that makes a difference.

If none of this works or is enlightening, try reading this and seeing if
it's helpful: http://kb.mozillazine.org/Plain_text_e-mail_-_Thunderbird

>
> Now I'm wondering how it deals with colors, if at all. My
> correspondents can see colors. I wonder if GG can. This sentence is in
> blue. This one's in red. And this one's in green.
>
> I don't really expect any rainbows. :-)
We didn't get any rainbows because your message was sent in plain text.
If you want to see red, you have to send in HTML. :)

Dan






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Tim Bourne
June 4th, 2014, 12:25 PM
,
> Now I'm wondering how it deals with colors, if at all. My correspondents
> can see colors. I wonder if GG can. This sentence is in blue. This one's in
> red. And this one's in green.

I'm reading with Thunderbird, and at the moment I have HTML turned on (usually it's off), but those
all appear black here.

Best wishes,
Tim Bourne.

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Johnb - co.uk
June 4th, 2014, 12:40 PM
In TB I can use *bold _under-scored_* /_*and italic also coloured*_/
and with a different page colour and font sizes

What you see depends on your settings


*John*


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John Barrs
June 4th, 2014, 02:38 PM
Hummh - I notice that gmail direct (in firefox) saw my colours etc -
everything except the page background colour

JohnnyB


On 4 June 2014 18:40, Johnb - co.uk <johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk> wrote:

> In TB I can use *bold under-scored* *and italic also coloured* and with
> a different page colour and font sizes
>
> What you see depends on your settings
>
>
> *John*
>
>
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Dodi Schultz
June 4th, 2014, 04:11 PM
Thanks, Johnny. I can clearly see all the things you mention, in both the
message I received /and/ this reply screen. I'm going to do a little
looking into the TBird options and do some experimenting, per Dan's
explanation.

--Dodi

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

On 6/4/2014 1:40 PM, Johnb - co.uk wrote:
> In TB I can use *bold _under-scored_* /_*and italic also coloured*_/ and
> with a different page colour and font sizes
>
> What you see depends on your settings
>
>

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John Barrs
June 5th, 2014, 04:33 AM
Dodi

the amusing thing is that your reply saying you could see all those things
has my email below it - in the <star>bold<star> <slash>italic<slash> type
format so it is obviously something in your TB settings which is affecting
the way gmail (in firefox) sees it

- but also

as I also receive copies of the email in TB -- my TB version of your reply
has an odd mix of <star> and bolded bold <underscore>and bolded underlined
<underscore> but although it has the <slash> it does not have any italic -
nor any colours

and... although gmail as I saw MY ORIGINAL in firefox had everything
except the page colour - the group sending of that to my Tbird - in TB -
had everything that I sent including my page-colour

JohnnyB


On 4 June 2014 22:11, Dodi Schultz <DodiSchultz (AT) verizon (DOT) net> wrote:

> Thanks, Johnny. I can clearly see all the things you mention, in both the
> message I received /and/ this reply screen. I'm going to do a little
> looking into the TBird options and do some experimenting, per Dan's
> explanation.
>
> --Dodi
>
> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>
> On 6/4/2014 1:40 PM, Johnb - co.uk wrote:
>
>> In TB I can use *bold _under-scored_* /_*and italic also coloured*_/ and
>> with a different page colour and font sizes
>>
>>
>> What you see depends on your settings
>>
>>
>>
> --
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> "Dixonary" group.
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> email to dixonary+unsubscribe (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com.
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>

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Dodi Schultz
June 5th, 2014, 10:16 AM
On 6/4/2014 12:29 PM, Daniel Widdis wrote:
> Try this. Go to your Thunderbird preferences (I think, on Windows, you'll
> go to Tools > Options; for me on my mac it's Thunderbird > Preferences).
> Click on the "Composition" tab. Near the bottom of that screen should be
> a line to "Configure text format behavior" with a button "Send Options".
> Click that. Then check your settings. Mine are to "Send the message in
> both plain text and HTML" and both the "Plain Text Domains" and "HTML
> Domains" are blank. Are yours configured similarly?
Mine also says both plain text and HTML. I've never listed anything in
"Domains".

> Also I have an "Options" menu when composing a message, which allows me
> to set "Delivery Format". I usually have it on "Auto Detect" which
> replies to text-only with text-only, and HTML with HTML. For this
> message, I specifically chose "Plain and Rich (HTML) Text".
I have that, too. And mine's also set on "Auto Detect". I haven't been
changing it for messages to Dixonary, and I didn't change it for this one.

> It also may be that your address book entry for Dixonary may be flagged
> "prefers to receive messages as plain text". Try editing your address
> book to see if that makes a difference.
No, there are no special notes there.

This is: /italic/ *bold* red green larger blue

--Dodi


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Dodi Schultz
June 5th, 2014, 10:35 AM
On 6/4/2014 12:29 PM, Daniel Widdis wrote:

> Also I have an "Options" menu when composing a message, which allows me
> to set "Delivery Format". I usually have it on "Auto Detect" which
> replies to text-only with text-only, and HTML with HTML. For this
> message, I specifically chose "Plain and Rich (HTML) Text".

This time, I've changed the setting to "Plan and Rich (HTML) Text". We'll
see what happens.

/italic/ *bold* red green larger blue

--Dodi

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Daniel Widdis
June 5th, 2014, 11:19 AM
Well, it's still coming out as plaintext only.

Can you please take a look at your Address Book setting for the contact
page for the Dixonary email address? Make sure the dropdown at the
bottom of the window "Prefers to receive messages as ..." is NOT set to
plain text. (Mine says "Unknown")

On 6/5/14, 8:35 AM, Dodi Schultz wrote:
> This time, I've changed the setting to "Plan and Rich (HTML) Text".
> We'll see what happens.
>
> /italic/ *bold* red green larger blue
>
> --Dodi
>

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Dodi Schultz
June 5th, 2014, 01:00 PM
On 6/5/2014 12:19 PM, Dan Widdis wrote:
> Well, it's still coming out as plaintext only.

Here, too.

> Can you please take a look at your Address Book setting for the contact
> page for the Dixonary email address? Make sure the dropdown at the bottom
> of the window "Prefers to receive messages as ..." is NOT set to plain
> text. (Mine says "Unknown")

So does mine.

Don't worry about it, Dan. As the subject line says, I was just curious.
It's not really terribly important. Thank you for trying, though. :-)

--Dodi


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Johnb - co.uk
June 5th, 2014, 02:51 PM
Dodi

what have you got in Tools-->Options-->Composition-->send options (if
anything)

and what have you got in Tools-->Options->Display-->Colors (especially
the bottom check box)

see also Tools-->Options->Display-->Advanced

Tip... if trying to do this when writing, use the Tools-->Options etc
back in the main TB window

finally -- lets miss out gmail... please send me privately at
johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk a message with all the variability and lets see
what happens


*John*
On 05/06/2014 19:00, Dodi Schultz wrote:
> On 6/5/2014 12:19 PM, Dan Widdis wrote:
>> Well, it's still coming out as plaintext only.
>
> Here, too.
>
>> Can you please take a look at your Address Book setting for the
>> contact page for the Dixonary email address? Make sure the dropdown
>> at the bottom of the window "Prefers to receive messages as ..." is
>> NOT set to plain text. (Mine says "Unknown")
>
> So does mine.
>
> Don't worry about it, Dan. As the subject line says, I was just
> curious. It's not really terribly important. Thank you for trying,
> though. :-)
>
> --Dodi
>
>

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Dodi Schultz
June 5th, 2014, 04:35 PM
Johnny, as I told Dan, it was just curiosity. It's not really important
enough to pursue further. Thanks, anyway.

--Dodi

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=--=-=-=-=-=-=-=


On 6/5/2014 3:51 PM, Johnb - co.uk wrote:
> Dodi
>
> what have you got in Tools-->Options-->Composition-->send options (if
> anything)
>
> and what have you got in Tools-->Options->Display-->Colors (especially
> the bottom check box)
>
> see also Tools-->Options->Display-->Advanced
>
> Tip... if trying to do this when writing, use the Tools-->Options etc
> back in the main TB window
>
> finally -- lets miss out gmail... please send me privately at
> johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk a message with all the variability and lets see
> what happens
>
>
> *John*

*=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=*
> On 05/06/2014 19:00, Dodi Schultz wrote:
>> On 6/5/2014 12:19 PM, Dan Widdis wrote:
>>> Well, it's still coming out as plaintext only.
>>
>> Here, too.
>>
>>> Can you please take a look at your Address Book setting for the contact
>>> page for the Dixonary email address? Make sure the dropdown at the
>>> bottom of the window "Prefers to receive messages as ..." is NOT set to
>>> plain text. (Mine says "Unknown")
>>
>> So does mine.
>>
>> Don't worry about it, Dan. As the subject line says, I was just curious.
>> It's not really terribly important. Thank you for trying, though. :-)
>>
>> --Dodi
>>
>>
>

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