[Dixonary] OT: Firefox Plug Ins

[Guerri Stevens]

When I started Firefox this morning, it instantly opened a second tab
for checking plug ins. My first thought was that I had somehow managed
to start that, but upon reflection, I don't see how I could have done
that by hitting a wrong key or sequence of keys.

I admit that my version of Firefox is woefully out of date. I admit that
some of my plugins are also out of date, and it offered, in the check
plug ins page, to update them, but I know, for example, that the new
version of the flash player is not compatible with my version of Firefox.

Some of the plug ins are designated as "vulnerable", but vulnerable to
what? Probably viruses or the like.

What particularly concerns me are two things: why is mozilla essentially
hijacking me into the plug in checking if indeed that is what it's
doing, and why now and not ever before?

The second thing is that it says, under "Frequently Asked Questions" is
that in the future, Firefox will update plugins for me. Does this mean
it will do so automatically, whether I want to do it or not, or even if
it is inconvenient timing for me?

I spent a little time looking at the options but I didn't see anything
that specified "automatically check plug ins". The fact that it did,
assuming it wasn't some stray keystroke on my part, makes me wonder what
else Firefox is doing that I don't know about.

Has anyone else seen this behavior? I am wondering whether it is time to
switch to a different browser.

--
Guerri

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[—Keith Hale—]

As a former web designer, (i often put that "reformed web designer") - but
also as a 49 year old that watched his brand new Windows 7 computer
destroyed by nothing at all but running the Windows Update --- i have some
perspective, and i live on the fence here.

Yes, when a version of Firefox, (or ANY browser, possibly) gets too out of
date -- it will automatically prompt you to update your version, and let
you know which plugins may not exist in newer versions, may be renamed,
work differently, etc. in the various versions you may move into. It is
"C. Y. A." but i understand. Making a web page look halfway decent for TWO
browsers (back when i started) - one version each was a colossal pain!
Now with at least 10 browsers, and MANY versions of each, i am sure that
problem is so much worse that it hurts my brain to even think about it.
The browser coders must feel that as badly as the page makers, probably
worse. In my day there were very few special features like cascading style
sheets, flash and a few others. Now there are countless scripts and
codes. Oy.

So, yeah, they need you - please pardon my filthy language here - ... *
update* your browser software.

There is certainly a fine argument to be made that change is often fraught
with huge pitfalls - i yell these arguments at my own screen with great
frequency and volume! And the Devil You Know can be a great comfort, even
while it is bedevilling you, over the one that will certainly 'behave' in
frustrating new ways.

In defence of Firefox - the first\best open source browser... i really
think it is either the best (or maybe tied with Chrome?). The plugins
("Add-Ons") let you customise in ways unheard of a handful of years ago.

Your last sentence triggers a suggestion from me. If you do elect to
"switch to a different browser" - you will be getting the latest version of
whichever you get. My suggestion is switch to the latest version of
Firefox (watch below for a further suggestion). It will still be a
"different Devil", but more familiar than the others (and i think the
best).

What i do addresses the understandable fears of losing access to important
chunks of the web i rely upon. It allows you to have your new devil, and
keep your old one.

I google this phrase: ["portable version" firefox]. I get the first
result: http://portableapps.com/apps/internet/firefox_portable .

Now, these apps are *intended for installation on USB thumb drives* and
such - but there is *zero *reason you can't run them on your computer's own
hard drive. And they are nicely self-sufficient. Self-contained. And so
i keep each version of the fiery, foxy devil with which i get comfortable
in this way, and i can find each and launch them if\when needed. I admit, *i
rarely do so anymore.*

You can also permanently park a thumb drive in one of your USB ports,
install the portable app there, and if you then travel without your PC, you
can bring the exact DYK (devil you know) along for the ride.

This is what i do, and the reasons i do it. It may not be the right fit
for you, but i wanted to share the possibility, as well as explain why the
changing web needs us to spiff up our software from time to time.

—Keith—


On 19 July 2013 08:44, Guerri Stevens <guerri (AT) guerristevens (DOT) com> wrote:

> Has anyone else seen this behavior? I am wondering whether it is time to
> switch to a different browser.

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[Dodi Schultz]

Guerri, the latest Firefox version is, I think, 22.

I'm using 17.0.1 and am very happy with it. Of course I get electronically
goosed to "upgrade" every once in a while. My mantra is: If it ain't broke,
don't fix it.

Firefox is a good browser (much superior to others I've tried) and an
increasing number of websites seem to be set for it.

DS

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[Steve Graham]

>>My mantra is: If it ain't broke, don't fix it.<<

Absolutely. See the attached

;-}

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[Dodi Schultz]

On 7/19/2013 6:14 PM, Steve Graham wrote:
>>> My mantra is: If it ain't broke, don't fix it.<<
> Absolutely. See the attached
>
> ;-}
>
That's adorable, Steve!

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[Guerri Stevens]

Where is the crescent cutout in the door?

Guerri

On 7/19/2013 6:14 PM, Steve Graham wrote:
>>> My mantra is: If it ain't broke, don't fix it.<<
> Absolutely. See the attached
>
>

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[Guerri Stevens]

I have suspected for a long time that I should update Firefox. I am
pretty sure the most recent flash player update I ran (not the latest)
is, like the current one, not compatible with my old version of Firefox.
So I will have to bite the bullet and update. Soon. But not today unless
it rains.

Guerri
On 7/19/2013 2:39 PM, —Keith Hale— wrote:
> As a former web designer, (i often put that "reformed web designer") -
> but also as a 49 year old that watched his brand new Windows 7
> computer destroyed by nothing at all but running the Windows Update
> --- i have some perspective, and i live on the fence here.
>
> Yes, when a version of Firefox, (or ANY browser, possibly) gets too
> out of date -- it will automatically prompt you to update your
> version, and let you know which plugins may not exist in newer
> versions, may be renamed, work differently, etc. in the various
> versions you may move into. It is "C. Y. A." but i understand. Making
> a web page look halfway decent for TWO browsers (back when i started)
> - one version each was a colossal pain! Now with at least 10
> browsers, and MANY versions of each, i am sure that problem is so much
> worse that it hurts my brain to even think about it. The browser
> coders must feel that as badly as the page makers, probably worse. In
> my day there were very few special features like cascading style
> sheets, flash and a few others. Now there are countless scripts and
> codes. Oy.
>
> So, yeah, they need you - please pardon my filthy language here - ...
> /update/ your browser software.
>
> There is certainly a fine argument to be made that change is often
> fraught with huge pitfalls - i yell these arguments at my own screen
> with great frequency and volume! And the Devil You Know can be a
> great comfort, even while it is bedevilling you, over the one that
> will certainly 'behave' in frustrating new ways.
>
> In defence of Firefox - the first\best open source browser... i really
> think it is either the best (or maybe tied with Chrome?). The plugins
> ("Add-Ons") let you customise in ways unheard of a handful of years ago.
>
> Your last sentence triggers a suggestion from me. If you do elect to
> "switch to a different browser" - you will be getting the latest
> version of whichever you get. My suggestion is switch to the latest
> version of Firefox (watch below for a further suggestion). It will
> still be a "different Devil", but more familiar than the others (and i
> think the best).
>
> What i do addresses the understandable fears of losing access to
> important chunks of the web i rely upon. It allows you to have your
> new devil, and keep your old one.
>
> I google this phrase: ["portable version" firefox]. I get the first
> result: http://portableapps.com/apps/internet/firefox_portable .
>
> Now, these apps are /intended for installation on USB thumb drives/
> and such - but there is /zero /reason you can't run them on your
> computer's own hard drive. And they are nicely self-sufficient.
> Self-contained. And so i keep each version of the fiery, foxy devil
> with which i get comfortable in this way, and i can find each and
> launch them if\when needed. I admit, /i rarely do so anymore./
>
> You can also permanently park a thumb drive in one of your USB ports,
> install the portable app there, and if you then travel without your
> PC, you can bring the exact DYK (devil you know) along for the ride.
>
> This is what i do, and the reasons i do it. It may not be the right
> fit for you, but i wanted to share the possibility, as well as explain
> why the changing web needs us to spiff up our software from time to time.
>
> —Keith—

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[Tim Lodge]

I'm with Keith on this - "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" doesn't apply
here. You might be missing out on security and bug fixes if you don't
update. It might be broke and you don't know it!

I allow Firefox to update itself every time there's a new release, and I
can't recall ever having a problem with that.

-- Tim L

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[davidh]

I don't think the policy of 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' applies.

Plugins are always broken, it's just a matter of weeks or months until bad guys find new security holes in ANY popular plugin.

Even if Firefox were to crash so terribly (worst case) when going to a new version of FF that it turned out to be impossible to uninstall and reinstall it (very improbable) you would likely lose very little. You could merely switch to Internet Explorer, Opera, Google Chrome, or Apple Safari, etc. You probably would not even lose your bookmarks because an alternate, one of those other browsers, could likely import bookmarks from a BROKEN DEAD Firefox.

BTW, I assume you have all your various ID's and passwords written down on paper somewhere, and NOT just recorded only in your browser.

BUT (and a big one), IF you got infected with malware because of an out of date (unpatched) plugin such as Adobe Reader, Flash, Java, Media Player, etc. it could turn your computer into a doorstop, at least until you reformat the HD and reinstall windows.

I use Secunia PSI and Qualys Browser Check to make sure that all my important software including plugins is patched up to date. But I only use these two web sites to tell me if some program or plugin is out of date. I normally don't use these two programs to perform the actual updating process per se. My theory being that Adobe knows better how to update Adobe software (e.g. Flash and Acrobat Reader) than any third party such as Secunia or Qualys. Similarly Oracle (formerly Sun) knows how to update Java better than any third party company, etc.

I especially like Qualys Browser Check because it is very fast because it only checks the most commonly used and thus the most commonly attacked plugins. It will run WITHOUT installing any software as long as you have Javascript (not Java) enabled, which I am sure you do. But you can also install their Qualys plugin if you so opt to do, to make the check a little faster and more thorough.

https://browsercheck.qualys.com/

I use Firefox almost exclusively and the constant new versions of it have caused me almost nil bother. And I use a fair number of FF extensions and plugins.

FF extensions I use:

AdBlock Plus
NoScript
Better Privacy
EPUBreader
FireFTP
RealDownLoader
RSS Icon

I'm pretty sure that I've been thru at least a dozen major revs of FF, or more, without a glitch in my extensions (and plugins as far as i can remember).

BTW, I do have a regular desktop windows program that requires Java to run. So I did NOT uninstall Java just because it has a reputation for being buggy and insecure. Instead I disabled Java plugin inside FF add on's. Of course some ppl do need Java to run inside their browsers, e.g. those who text chat in Compuserve forum live chats.

P.S.
FF has had a nice feature for a while that I probably had not used until posting this msg,, namely, 'Recently Closed Tabs' under History in the Menu bar. I accidentally closed the tab in which I was editing this message and thought I'd lost the msg. til I remembered seeing this feature in the menu bar. I tried it and fortunately lost none of the rather long msg. I'd typed. This feature alone might be enuf payback for the bother of updating FF ?

[Guerri Stevens]

Well, I bit the bullet on Thunderbird, and I don't like some of the new
"features". The stupid stars next to the to and from addresses, for
instance. OK, they don't really force me to change my habits, but I
consider them unnecessary.

You are right about Firefox, though. It is time for me to update. And I
know already that I am unlikely to be happy with the newer version, but
I can probably adapt. (sigh)

Guerri

On 7/20/2013 5:51 AM, Tim Lodge wrote:
> I'm with Keith on this - "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" doesn't
> apply here. You might be missing out on security and bug fixes if you
> don't update. It might be broke and you don't know it!
>
> I allow Firefox to update itself every time there's a new release, and
> I can't recall ever having a problem with that.
>
> -- Tim L

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[EnDash@aol.com]

I've always kept updating Firefox (now up to 20-something) and have never
been sorry for doing so. Don't worry; be happy. :-)

-- Dick



In a message dated 7/21/2013 7:26:47 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
guerri (AT) guerristevens (DOT) com writes:

You are right about Firefox, though. It is time for me to update. And I
know already that I am unlikely to be happy with the newer version, but
I can probably adapt. (sigh)


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